Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

I think US college education is nearer to collapsing than it appears

twitter.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

141–150 of 1001 posts

Re: I think US college education is nearer to collapsing than it appears

#141

Post by mistrial9 »

tessierashpool wrote: post #72
crackercrews wrote: post #52

Definitely agree that removing the SAT appears to be related to the upcoming supreme court case about affirmative action. COVID was a good reason to delay it for a couple years. But schools are pushing it out further. That makes no sense. It seems the SAT is increasingly considered "racist" because it reveals racial disparities in learning. What's next? Get rid of the driver's license test because it turns that white…

that is entirely a guess, though. there's actual documented evidence of colleges admitting less Asian-Americans and Jews than the test scores of either group would suggest, and Altman refers to this phenomenon in the thread. > It seems the SAT is increasingly considered "racist" because it reveals racial disparities in learning. What's next? Get rid of the driver's license test because it turns that white kids pass i…

> the SAT's a way of laundering discrepancies in generational wealth

this is a ludicrous modern reinterpretation of SAT testing.. sure, testing has lots of downsides.. linking it to "wealth laundering" is your own obsessions showing IMO

Re: I think US college education is nearer to collapsing than it appears

#142

Post by com2kid »

mind-blight wrote: post #58

I'm concerned that the majority of "should we fix college or should we circumvent college" conversations don't bring up one of the scariest parts of our current economy: STEM jobs are the main viable path for economic stability and freedom. All of the conversations I've seen implicitly assume that this is good, and that the solution to farmer workers (or other low paid workers) escaping poverty is to train them as so…

America is a country that loves the free market country, yet no one seems to be talking about supply and demand to fix college prices.

Double the number of large quality state universities.

Re-index public university tuition to what they were in 2000 + inflation. Mandate that funding comes with X number increase in tenured professors.

Re-instate public funding for state universities to what it was in 2000 + inflation.

A supply/demand imbalance is in effect, and bloat has taken hold on top of that.

Yes building new 20k student universities takes time, but in 20 years these problems will be solved.

Re: I think US college education is nearer to collapsing than it appears

#143

Post by agumonkey »

mind-blight wrote: post #58

I'm concerned that the majority of "should we fix college or should we circumvent college" conversations don't bring up one of the scariest parts of our current economy: STEM jobs are the main viable path for economic stability and freedom. All of the conversations I've seen implicitly assume that this is good, and that the solution to farmer workers (or other low paid workers) escaping poverty is to train them as so…

what about a wise form of agrotech ?

Re: I think US college education is nearer to collapsing than it appears

#144

Post by jtbayly »

tester756 wrote: post #110
webmaven wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cards?

>have a card up your sleeve >to have an advantage that other people do not know about: (without that last part)

Typically I’ve heard the construction “dealt a better hand”

Re: I think US college education is nearer to collapsing than it appears

#145

Post by flatiron »

Tretiotrr wrote: post #57

In Germany you study for free. There was a video (perhaps even from kurzgesagt) which describes how critical it is for our society to allow as many people as easy access to knowledge as possible and not only for obvious reasons but also to increase the chance for all of us that the hidden genius is finding a cure for cancer. You can even study for free in Germany as an non German. You know what happens? Those people…

I think the argument would be better if Germany was some sort of education haven. My cousin fosters study abroad kids in the US and most are German. They say the German education isn’t anything to tout and having an American education on your CV is a big +. I’m not saying this whole thing is perfect but I just don’t see anyone banging down the doors for a German education.

Re: I think US college education is nearer to collapsing than it appears

#146

Post by mistrial9 »

0898 wrote: post #132

Some kid is going to stand up and say: “You can throw me in jail or cancel my degree but I’m not paying my student debt… who’s with me?” And then the whole house of cards that is higher education collapses.

my first wife was older than me, and she never paid her student loans. She never had credit of any substance for the rest of her life (this was long ago and I know this is true).

Re: I think US college education is nearer to collapsing than it appears

#147

Post by wenmoon »

gruez wrote: post #93
mind-blight wrote: post #58

I'm concerned that the majority of "should we fix college or should we circumvent college" conversations don't bring up one of the scariest parts of our current economy: STEM jobs are the main viable path for economic stability and freedom. All of the conversations I've seen implicitly assume that this is good, and that the solution to farmer workers (or other low paid workers) escaping poverty is to train them as so…

>STEM jobs are the main viable path for economic stability and freedom. >We really need farm workers, and most of them live in poverty. I love having more engineers, scientists, and doctors, but we desperately need non-STEM work to be a viable option This is basically a non-problem because of the supply/demand mechanics of the labor market. If farm workers' job gets sufficiently bad from a value proposition perspecti…

during the peak of the COVID labor shortage, many producers did increase wages but found that they still couldn't get workers. also in North America at least, many/most laborers are undocumented immigrants. white collar workers aren't quitting the desk to go out in the field..it is backbreaking work. if the labor pipeline dries up (which is a very real thing as immigration has decreased in North America/the US) then no one will be doing that job.

i suspect the amount of money that farms would need to pay workers to fix these shortages would drive all producers into bankruptcy

Re: I think US college education is nearer to collapsing than it appears

#148

Post by titzer »

gruez wrote: post #93
mind-blight wrote: post #58

I'm concerned that the majority of "should we fix college or should we circumvent college" conversations don't bring up one of the scariest parts of our current economy: STEM jobs are the main viable path for economic stability and freedom. All of the conversations I've seen implicitly assume that this is good, and that the solution to farmer workers (or other low paid workers) escaping poverty is to train them as so…

>STEM jobs are the main viable path for economic stability and freedom. >We really need farm workers, and most of them live in poverty. I love having more engineers, scientists, and doctors, but we desperately need non-STEM work to be a viable option This is basically a non-problem because of the supply/demand mechanics of the labor market. If farm workers' job gets sufficiently bad from a value proposition perspecti…

> If farm workers' job gets sufficiently bad from a value proposition perspective, then people will leave the occupation

They are. Farmer suicides over the past 10 years have skyrocketed. Farmers are committing suicide at twice the rate of combat veterans. [1]

I'm afraid I can't take your comment seriously as a dispassionate economic analysis since it lacks even basic empathy for people caught in this ongoing trainwreck of "supply/demand" mechanics.

[1] https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/dec/06/why-are-amer...

Re: I think US college education is nearer to collapsing than it appears

#149

Post by rahimnathwani »

mind-blight wrote: post #58

I'm concerned that the majority of "should we fix college or should we circumvent college" conversations don't bring up one of the scariest parts of our current economy: STEM jobs are the main viable path for economic stability and freedom. All of the conversations I've seen implicitly assume that this is good, and that the solution to farmer workers (or other low paid workers) escaping poverty is to train them as so…

> We really need farm workers, and most of them live in poverty.

How are both of these true? If a job pays poorly, doesn't that suggest there are many people willing and able to do those jobs, relative to the need for the job to be done?

Maybe this results from some market distortion? But AFAIK the main market distortion in the farming industry is the opposite: subsidies that make farming more attractive than it would be, which would tend to increase farm workers' equilibrium wages.

Re: I think US college education is nearer to collapsing than it appears

#150

Post by 6gvONxR4sf7o »

gruez wrote: post #93
mind-blight wrote: post #58

I'm concerned that the majority of "should we fix college or should we circumvent college" conversations don't bring up one of the scariest parts of our current economy: STEM jobs are the main viable path for economic stability and freedom. All of the conversations I've seen implicitly assume that this is good, and that the solution to farmer workers (or other low paid workers) escaping poverty is to train them as so…

>STEM jobs are the main viable path for economic stability and freedom. >We really need farm workers, and most of them live in poverty. I love having more engineers, scientists, and doctors, but we desperately need non-STEM work to be a viable option This is basically a non-problem because of the supply/demand mechanics of the labor market. If farm workers' job gets sufficiently bad from a value proposition perspecti…

Abstractions around frictionless marketplaces don’t work well in markets with as extreme friction as the labor market.
Post reply on HN