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Google will soon ask Australian users to show ID to view some content

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Re: Google will soon ask Australian users to show ID to view some content

#141

Post by idiotsecant »

jimmaswell wrote: post #107
LewisVerstappen wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>"If our systems are unable to establish that a viewer is above the age of 18, we will request that they provide a valid ID or credit card to verify their age.” I don't think Google is complaining too much. Especially if it gives them an excuse to collect credit card data (reducing a significant amount of friction when they sell YouTube premium / google drive subscriptions).

I had no idea you could actually use a credit card to verify age. I thought that was nothing but a scam employed by fraudulent cam/hookup sites and catfishers. Google probably shouldn't train people that this is a normal thing to do.

Does a credit card in fact verify age? Anyone at all can go buy a prepaid card at the grocery store, right?

Re: Google will soon ask Australian users to show ID to view some content

#142

Post by NoSorryCannot »

Broken_Hippo wrote: post #137
cr1895 wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> passports are essentially a national ID system Not very helpful as a national ID if they are a relative rarity

That is only because the average person is priced out of it, honestly. If I remember correctly, it cost around days work if you make minimum wage.

Right, but I think the concept of a national ID necessarily has the property of everyone (as close as is feasible) having one because it is required and they should be stable across time. Passports are optional, they expire, and they aren't stable. Not everyone can get an American passport (e.g., non-citizens).

Tax IDs are as close as we've got.

Re: Google will soon ask Australian users to show ID to view some content

#143

Post by seanmcdirmid »

Drdrdrq wrote: post #100
seanmcdirmid wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Chrome will save credit card data on request, it’s incredibly convenient if you do a lot of online food ordering.

Convenience is often the biggest enemy of privacy.

The current system where we can choose between security and convenience is good enough for me. I loath those who would take that choice away from me.

Re: Google will soon ask Australian users to show ID to view some content

#144

Post by MereInterest »

jmole wrote: post #138
dessant wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Age verification is already mandated in the EU, and when you provide your credit card details to Google's age verification system for YouTube, they create a payments profile for you without consent. The Google account is set up for purchasing services across all Google properties, without needing to provide further payment details. Google is exploiting the requirement for age verification to set up Google accounts fo…

Or, they’re using the only consumer-focused credit card verification system they have (google pay), and “prevent users from using their credit cards” was never on the roadmap…

Suppose I asked you if I could borrow your car to get groceries. A week later, I take your car again and go for a road trip. You would be justified in being mad at me, because (1) the consent didn't cover the use and (2) the initial consent was for a limited time.

Google has an obligation to verify age. Google also has an obligation to limit tracking of personal information to usages that have been consented to. Neither of these obligations negate the other, and if Google never put it onto their feature roadmap, that just means that Google has been negligent in fulfilling their obligations.

Re: Google will soon ask Australian users to show ID to view some content

#145

Post by srcreigh »

MereInterest wrote: post #139
dessant wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Age verification is already mandated in the EU, and when you provide your credit card details to Google's age verification system for YouTube, they create a payments profile for you without consent. The Google account is set up for purchasing services across all Google properties, without needing to provide further payment details. Google is exploiting the requirement for age verification to set up Google accounts fo…

Isn't that a pretty straightforward violation of the GDPR? Consent to track somebody's personal information requires the data subject to be informed as to the use of the information, and personal information may not be used outside of the usages that were consented to.

The consent Google requests could be very broad.

I wonder does GDPR specify different categories of consent which must be specifically and separately requested?

Re: Google will soon ask Australian users to show ID to view some content

#146

Post by sva_ »

iso1210 wrote: post #73
WinterMount223 wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Could you explain further?

Imagine you are visiting hacker news, and for some reason you have to prove your age, but you don't want HN to know who you are, nor your age identity site to know you're going to HN One way to do this off the top mf my head would be HN issues a unique number (say 4096 bit) to you when you create an account You send that number to your identity provider along with confirming proof of age The identity provider signs t…

But this way ppl could falsely verify their age by using a shared identity, unless the identity provider saves the identity (and shares it with other such providers)?

Re: Google will soon ask Australian users to show ID to view some content

#147

Post by adventured »

idiotsecant wrote: post #141
jimmaswell wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I had no idea you could actually use a credit card to verify age. I thought that was nothing but a scam employed by fraudulent cam/hookup sites and catfishers. Google probably shouldn't train people that this is a normal thing to do.

Does a credit card in fact verify age? Anyone at all can go buy a prepaid card at the grocery store, right?

> Does a credit card in fact verify age? Anyone at all can go buy a prepaid card at the grocery store, right?

A prepaid card isn't a credit card. Payment processors can tell the difference between card types. You have to be 18 or older to get a credit card issued in your name (although you can add an underage authorized user to your card). And there are now other requirements needed if you're under 21 in the US, such as proof of income or a cosigner.

A prepaid card is also not a debit card (debit cards are attached to a bank account). To get a debit card you must be either 18 or have a legal guardian who is at least 18 on the account.

Re: Google will soon ask Australian users to show ID to view some content

#148

Post by dessant »

srcreigh wrote: post #145
MereInterest wrote: post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't that a pretty straightforward violation of the GDPR? Consent to track somebody's personal information requires the data subject to be informed as to the use of the information, and personal information may not be used outside of the usages that were consented to.

The consent Google requests could be very broad. I wonder does GDPR specify different categories of consent which must be specifically and separately requested?

They did not ask for consent to set up a payments profile during age verification.

Though what you're describing would also be illegal. GDPR does not allow requesting consent for such broad data processing just to fulfill a legal requirement to verify the user's age, and then denying access to the service if the user understandably refuses to give consent.

Re: Google will soon ask Australian users to show ID to view some content

#149

Post by seanmcdirmid »

Broken_Hippo wrote: post #135
seanmcdirmid wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

An American passport ID number changes every ten years, causing lots of problems when foreign banks (like Chinese ones) try to use it as a stable ID number. Source: personal experience.

I've had absolutely no issues with it here in Norway, but Norway gives folks a number much like a SSN, which is used more widely than a SS# in the US alongside a picture ID.

China uses foreigner passport IDs in place of a Chinese ID number. Which is kind of dumb since that number changes, which caught the bank by surprise. I had to carry around both my old and new passport for awhile after my first renewal.

Re: Google will soon ask Australian users to show ID to view some content

#150

Post by justinclift »

MereInterest wrote: post #139
dessant wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Age verification is already mandated in the EU, and when you provide your credit card details to Google's age verification system for YouTube, they create a payments profile for you without consent. The Google account is set up for purchasing services across all Google properties, without needing to provide further payment details. Google is exploiting the requirement for age verification to set up Google accounts fo…

Isn't that a pretty straightforward violation of the GDPR? Consent to track somebody's personal information requires the data subject to be informed as to the use of the information, and personal information may not be used outside of the usages that were consented to.

There's "the law", and there's "what big corporations will attempt to get away with anyway".

Because whatever happens in court (if it gets that far), they'll have years of appeals to go, and that'll be some future Google employee's problem not the current people.

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