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Crypto is an unproductive bubble

alexkolchinski.com

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Re: Crypto is an unproductive bubble

#221

Post by cf141q5325 »

danShumway wrote: post #214
cf141q5325 wrote: post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then you are not the target audience. You want additional safety at the cost of giving up your autonomy. Good luck with that

If you're trying to build a functional currency, you can't really afford to say that the majority of people earning and spending money are "not the target audience." That's not how currency works, people have to want your coins for you to spend them. At best, having this perspective relegates Bitcoin to be nothing more than a speculative asset/investment. But if you want it to be more than that and you're just scoffi…

Currencies dont really work at the "may the best one win" level, especially with so much political power behind it. You have a dominant one which stays dominant till it implodes. Then people fall back to the next best thing. You dont need to be attractive, it just has to work.

Re: Crypto is an unproductive bubble

#222

Post by mdoms »

cf141q5325 wrote: post #162
babypuncher wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They view it as a feature, but for all the reasons this poster pointed out, the rest of us view it as an anti-feature.

Then you are not the target audience. You want additional safety at the cost of giving up your autonomy. Good luck with that

If "most sane people" are not the target audience it makes you wonder who is.

Re: Crypto is an unproductive bubble

#223

Post by randomhodler84 »

jmcgough wrote: post #60
Jommi wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're starting a fight you can't win here Your base assumption of knowing or finding them is not strong Crypto means you will always know who has your money and where it goes. We can build systems around repercussions for crypto too.

> You're starting a fight you can't win here I'm not starting a fight, I'm having a discussion, which I think is the point of HN. > Crypto means you will always know who has your money and where it goes. If a stranger in another country steals $500 from me I'm going to have a really hard time doing anything about it. And knowing their wallet doesn't mean I know who they actually are, as those aren't tied to an identi…

Why would someone in another country steal your money unless you give it to them.

Don’t get involved in shady schemes and try to double your money.

I encourage you to put a tiny bit of fiat into the system and play with it. Low risk. Buy some Bitcoin. Make a wallet on your phone and transfer it. I think it’s something that needs to be seen to understand. Stop fearing what is designed not to happen.

Re: Crypto is an unproductive bubble

#224

Post by imachine1980_ »

zozbot234 wrote: post #199
Nextgrid wrote: post #145

Cryptocurrencies have a valid but very specific use-case: being able to transact in a hostile environment. It does so by making certain trade-offs such as an energy-intensive verification process. This is a very valid use-case when you need to transact against the will of a powerful adversary such as governments. It needs to be there and needs to be protected just like free speech needs to be protected. However, day-…

The government need not even be especially hostile per se, just unwilling or unable to adjudicate that particular transaction. With crypto, the basic operation of the transaction is enforced via a mechanism shared by all users of that cryptocurrency, and a mutually-trusted third-party arbitrator (or even a more complex decision mechanism , defined by a smart contract) can be chosen to address any potential concerns i…

except that in some case this private companies can change the rules of the game like happens whit etherium, who fork the blockhains after one of the biggest owner being theft for have an insecure smart contracts, and some Blockchain only allow certein type of transactions, o request specific fees for gambling for example.

Re: Crypto is an unproductive bubble

#225

Post by hiyer »

ipaddr wrote: post #207
Nextgrid wrote: post #145

Cryptocurrencies have a valid but very specific use-case: being able to transact in a hostile environment. It does so by making certain trade-offs such as an energy-intensive verification process. This is a very valid use-case when you need to transact against the will of a powerful adversary such as governments. It needs to be there and needs to be protected just like free speech needs to be protected. However, day-…

Government is not the only reason. The credit card cartel will deny certain types of businesses in areas they consider shady like sex toys or legal drugs or certain media. Cryto offers a payment method for these cases.

You don't need crypto for that. Cash will work. Or a system like India's UPI - direct, instantaneous inter-bank transfer, with no fees, via mobile apps.

Re: Crypto is an unproductive bubble

#226

Post by propter_hoc »

mlyle wrote: post #86
acjohnson55 wrote: post #39

> Claim 2: Blockchain technology has no non-monetary applications (Confidence: High) I would replace "non-monetery" with "non-financial". I think it's a perfectly reasonable (albeit, imperfect) solution as a ledger and exchange mechanism for new financial assets.

What about just non-repudiation? Proving a logfile, or evidence, etc, is from before a certain date and hasn't been tampered with?

For any document in the form of PDF files, this is fairly trivially done using a certified PDF signed by a member of the Adobe Approved Trust List. Other data could be signed by PGP from an issuer that publicizes its public key. In practically every use case there exist trusted parties, obviating the value of decentralized certification.

Re: Crypto is an unproductive bubble

#227

Post by randomhodler84 »

bobsmooth wrote: post #173
exolymph wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You probably don't mean it to, but this reinforces my point. You trust the government? I sure don't.

I trust the government more than I trust the blockchain.

Bad call.

Governments can change things. Blockchain is eternal.

Re: Crypto is an unproductive bubble

#228

Post by danShumway »

jgod wrote: post #183
Nextgrid wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You just need to control the onramps and offramps. Bitcoin is of no use if you can't exchange it for anything tangible.

All that's required for people to exchange it for something tangible, is for people to start.

And among other things a price that's stable enough that you can actually cost goods without the value spiking upwards or downwards under your feet.

Zoom out to the "all" range on https://www.bitcoinprice.com/ and try to tell me with a straight face that you're looking at a graph that belongs to a stable currency. Heck, even just look at the last two years.

Part of the problem with Bitcoin in specific among all of these cryptocurrencies is that the Bitcoin community in particular is completely divided on whether they want a speculative asset or a functional currency. You can not have both. A currency that is regularly spiking in value to the degree that Bitcoin spikes (even a currency that spikes upwards in value) is not suitable for everyday transactions. A currency that doubles or even triples its value in 2 years is not a good currency.

The bigger thing to understand is that it is impossible to fix this problem with Bitcoin, because a sizable portion of the Bitcoin community doesn't want Bitcoin to be a currency. They want a speculative asset. In my opinion, that portion of the community is significantly larger and has significantly more influence than the portion of the community trying to create a currency.

Re: Crypto is an unproductive bubble

#229

Post by paulpauper »

If it's a bubble, it's a pretty lousy one in terms of returns. Some energy stocks were up 100-1000% a week ago due to surging oil prices. And then some SPACs were up 500%. Some guy on reddit's wallstreetbets recently turned $17k into $600k with amazon call options. I never seen anyone make those kind of returns with crypto...just guys with tiny Binance or Coinbase accounts who are happy to make 20% from a $1000 initial investment.

The same coins now like litecoin are unchanged even as far back as 2017. So either it's a weak bubble or a deflated one. Compared to stocks, Crypto is dead..nothing goes up for more than a day..tons of wash trading. tons of scams.

3x tech etfs are way better than bitcoin anyway. I would rather own TECL and TQQQ instead of bitcoin. TECL and TQQQ were up over 100% in 2021 compared to 60% returns for bitcoin.

Re: Crypto is an unproductive bubble

#230

Post by gonehome »

danShumway wrote: post #228
jgod wrote: post #183

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All that's required for people to exchange it for something tangible, is for people to start.

And among other things a price that's stable enough that you can actually cost goods without the value spiking upwards or downwards under your feet. Zoom out to the "all" range on https://www.bitcoinprice.com/ and try to tell me with a straight face that you're looking at a graph that belongs to a stable currency. Heck, even just look at the last two years. Part of the problem with Bitcoin in specific among all of th…

That’s not that big of a deal, just move BTC into a stable coin first and then use that for the transaction.

Bitcoin is more akin to a gold like store of value than a currency.

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