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Launch HN: AirMyne (YC W22) – Capturing CO2 from air at industrial scale

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Re: Launch HN: AirMyne (YC W22) – Capturing CO2 from air at industrial scale

#171

Post by noselasd »

yodon wrote: post #35

I want to be excited about this, but it's capturing CO2 as CO2 gas, not sequestering CO2 in a form that keeps it out of the atmosphere. If you pay a lot of money in process and power to pull CO2 out of the atmosphere or out of exhaust gases and then use it in chemical processes other than ones which sink the carbon into long lasting solid, liquid, or oceanic absorption form you're just burning money and power to make…

Isn't the idea to pump the captured co2 underground, where the proper reactions take place to turn this more or less into rock ? I'm not sure anyone was suggesting to actually store the co2 long term as a gas or liquid

Re: Launch HN: AirMyne (YC W22) – Capturing CO2 from air at industrial scale

#172

Post by noselasd »

marcosdumay wrote: post #116
markcyffka wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most all of it comes as a side product. The amount of CO2 used for the applications listed pales in comparison to the amount used for urea (fertilizer) production.

What is different is that urea requires a power source that creates more CO2 than the chemical process uses. So you will certainly (as long as you are using fossil fuels) have a source available. Those things I mentioned buy their CO2 on the market. I have no idea where it comes from.

Urea production requires ammonia, and the production of ammonia produces co2 in large quantities. It's not without reason the two are almost always loacted closely

Re: Launch HN: AirMyne (YC W22) – Capturing CO2 from air at industrial scale

#173

Post by tinco »

tinco wrote: post #163
ncmncm wrote: post #119

It should be much more cost-effective to float wind turbines to pump surface water to benthic depths. Then, the whole ocean is your CO2 collection surface. You might also pump water from (lesser) depths to the surface to distribute over coral reefs to relieve both heat and pH. (Picture a line of these some miles seaward, all up and down the Great Barrier Reef.) The wind turbine nacelle could be substantially cheaper…

Where did you learn about this idea? I've been trying to get up to speed on climate change solutions and I thought I heard just about everything but this is the first I've heard this solution and it sounds like it might make total sense. Are there companies developing these pump mills?

Also, wouldn't it be even nicer to pump up the cold water? That way you decrease the acidity of the surface water more strongly, increasing the acidic uptake of the surface water, and you also cool it down more.

If we did that for example in the East Australian Current north of Vanuatu, we might help out the Great Barrier Reef a little, moderating both the temperature and the acidity. It's like 3 birds with one stone.

I guess pumping up has the additional complexity of having the intake all the way down at 2KM, which is also where you'd need to do the maintenance. But maybe you could float up the entire pipe for maintenance.

Seems a similar idea has been proposed, but from a depth of a mere 40m: https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2017/apr/07/plan-col....

Re: Launch HN: AirMyne (YC W22) – Capturing CO2 from air at industrial scale

#174

Post by amelius »

yodon wrote: post #35

I want to be excited about this, but it's capturing CO2 as CO2 gas, not sequestering CO2 in a form that keeps it out of the atmosphere. If you pay a lot of money in process and power to pull CO2 out of the atmosphere or out of exhaust gases and then use it in chemical processes other than ones which sink the carbon into long lasting solid, liquid, or oceanic absorption form you're just burning money and power to make…

What happens if you bring CO2 to insane temperatures? Will that break C from O2? Could we reuse the stored heat somehow?

Re: Launch HN: AirMyne (YC W22) – Capturing CO2 from air at industrial scale

#175

Post by ncmncm »

tinco wrote: post #163
ncmncm wrote: post #119

It should be much more cost-effective to float wind turbines to pump surface water to benthic depths. Then, the whole ocean is your CO2 collection surface. You might also pump water from (lesser) depths to the surface to distribute over coral reefs to relieve both heat and pH. (Picture a line of these some miles seaward, all up and down the Great Barrier Reef.) The wind turbine nacelle could be substantially cheaper…

Where did you learn about this idea? I've been trying to get up to speed on climate change solutions and I thought I heard just about everything but this is the first I've heard this solution and it sounds like it might make total sense. Are there companies developing these pump mills?

A proposal showed up here on HN, maybe a month ago. I will try to find it. It seems like a good place to invest.

Re: Launch HN: AirMyne (YC W22) – Capturing CO2 from air at industrial scale

#176

Post by ncmncm »

shafyy wrote: post #159
ncmncm wrote: post #119

It should be much more cost-effective to float wind turbines to pump surface water to benthic depths. Then, the whole ocean is your CO2 collection surface. You might also pump water from (lesser) depths to the surface to distribute over coral reefs to relieve both heat and pH. (Picture a line of these some miles seaward, all up and down the Great Barrier Reef.) The wind turbine nacelle could be substantially cheaper…

I'm not a marine or ocean expert, but won't pumping large amounts of surface water to benthic depths have a huge impact on the marine life, currents and so on?

We are already making a huge impact on marine life, today, with increasingly disastrous consequences. This reduces that impact.

Re: Launch HN: AirMyne (YC W22) – Capturing CO2 from air at industrial scale

#177

Post by [deleted] »

ncmncm wrote: post #156
peter422 wrote: post #155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is significant friction between the water and the tube that needs to be accounted for. The longer the tube, the more friction there is.

But the bigger its cross section, and the slower the water inside moves, the less friction there is. A fabric tube 10 or 20 feet across would work as well as a pipe. It could stick up a few feet above the surface, and the pump just lift water over the edge into it.

[deleted]

Re: Launch HN: AirMyne (YC W22) – Capturing CO2 from air at industrial scale

#178

Post by specialist »

ncmncm wrote: post #119

It should be much more cost-effective to float wind turbines to pump surface water to benthic depths. Then, the whole ocean is your CO2 collection surface. You might also pump water from (lesser) depths to the surface to distribute over coral reefs to relieve both heat and pH. (Picture a line of these some miles seaward, all up and down the Great Barrier Reef.) The wind turbine nacelle could be substantially cheaper…

Churning ocean water is a terrific idea. Especially the added benefit protecting habitats. Thanks for sharing.

--

I also have no clue about the economics of carbon capture. Maybe ask David Roberts? He has always answered my emails. (Note he's currently on vacation.)

Roberts is my current primary source for climate and energy policy news. He definitely talks to all the right people, eg Saul Griffins.

Here's a sample of his articles which may be relevant to your question:

These uses of CO2 could cut emissions — and make trillions of dollars [2019] https://www.vox.com/energy-and-environment/2019/11/13/208395...

A simpler, more useful way to tax carbon [2020] https://www.vox.com/energy-and-environment/2020/8/17/2137073...

Volts podcast: Sen. Tina Smith on the promise of a Clean Electricity Payment Program [2021] https://www.volts.wtf/p/volts-podcast-sen-tina-smith-on-the

Volts podcast: Rebecca Dell on decarbonizing heavy industry [2022] https://www.volts.wtf/p/volts-podcast-rebecca-dell-on-decarb...

Re: Launch HN: AirMyne (YC W22) – Capturing CO2 from air at industrial scale

#179

Post by markcyffka »

noselasd wrote: post #172
marcosdumay wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What is different is that urea requires a power source that creates more CO2 than the chemical process uses. So you will certainly (as long as you are using fossil fuels) have a source available. Those things I mentioned buy their CO2 on the market. I have no idea where it comes from.

Urea production requires ammonia, and the production of ammonia produces co2 in large quantities. It's not without reason the two are almost always loacted closely

Great point & not so often talked about. Something like 230Mton of CO2 are used each year, a little more than half goes straight to urea production. By contrast only about 10% goes to the food/bev, medical, and other applications we are more familiar with on a day-to-day basis.

plot showing the breakdown with some gov't sources. --> https://www.iea.org/reports/putting-co2-to-use

Re: Launch HN: AirMyne (YC W22) – Capturing CO2 from air at industrial scale

#180

Post by sharpener »

Why CO2 from air vs. extraction from seawater? I remember seeing some papers (e.g. [0]) suggesting the from seawater route was way more efficient per m^3 processed with a lot less environmental disturbance.

[0] https://doi.org/10.1021/ie502128x

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