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Doctors who use Google Translate to talk to patients want a better option

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Re: Doctors who use Google Translate to talk to patients want a better option

#151
post #12

Deepl is a better option. It feels several years ahead of Google Translate in quality. I know enough Japanese to hurt myself, and Deepl is definitely giving the superior translations, by far, which is great for my studies. As an analogy, it’s like going from 144p to 360p (a good human translation ranges from 720p to 4k+). Yeah 360p video is still blurry but it’s in a different league than 144p.

I find Deepl to be far superior to Google Translate.

The key is of course to use grammatically correct, unambiguous language to begin with.

If it's electronic communication, you can always reverse the translation to check it translates back to your original.

Re: Doctors who use Google Translate to talk to patients want a better option

#152
post #3

There has been a better option for a long time, called on-staff Medical Interpreters. In fact, my spouse worked as one for approximately seven years. Unfortunately due to hospitals consolidating into medical networks and cutting costs wherever they could, this went from on-staff interpreters, to contract interpreters, to on-call phone interpreters (works incredibly poorly), to google translate. Blame the beurocrats r…

This is a better option in quality, but seems more difficult to handle at any significant scale. Having a wide availability of highly trained, on premise professionals in every single location looks unrealistic to me.

What would be your middle-ground proposition for the large swath of doctor cabinets and hospitals who won't win/can't afford enough of the on-staff interpreters lottery and still get patients that need support in different languages ?

Re: Doctors who use Google Translate to talk to patients want a better option

#153
post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That approach is best for cases where it works, for example in areas where there is a large minority of speakers of a given language (Spanish in the US, for example). But if the patient speaks a language that is unusual for the area, finding an interpreter is going to be more difficult, or maybe not possible in some cases.

You have a similar problem with respect to criminal trials of defendants who speak minority languages. You can find a Khmer interpreter easily enough in Los Angeles, but good luck in Miami.

I’ve heard anecdotally from lawyer friends that despite how fucked up the US justice system is in so many ways, one bright spot is the lengths to which they’ll go to find interpreters.

One Guatemalan defendant who natively spoke a Mayan language had to go through a chain of three court-appointed interpreters: one from his language to a different, more widely-spoken Mayan language, one to go from that to Spanish, and one from Spanish to English. He told my friend (his lawyer) something like: “this is amazing; in Guatemala they’d have just told me ‘sorry, the national language is Spanish’ and I’ve had been out of luck!”

I don’t believe it would be legally possible in the US to convict a monolingual Khmer speaker of a crime without providing an interpreter, in Miami or anywhere else.

Re: Doctors who use Google Translate to talk to patients want a better option

#154
post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> developers are not invested in EMR software I know a handful of companies that went through YC trying to build EMR software and have met many more people since who are interested in this problem. It is not a lack of interest from engineers.

Hey! I'm one of those people. I'm building an Ophthalmology EMR. But I do have a question for you at your past job. At Curative were the labs/exams handled on site, or was it partnered with a lab to handle them?

Does your product just cram an ophthalmology scribe into an old sun e10k chassis?

Re: Doctors who use Google Translate to talk to patients want a better option

#155
post #97
post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

EMR software, like all medical software, suffers from a variation of the Dead Sea Effect. Those who are truly invested in EMR software are not developers and developers are not invested in EMR software. So, as a developer, it's a job you take because you need a job. And if you're competent, you can get a job elsewhere eventually. If you're not, well, it's not like medical software has a deep talent pool to draw from.…

> developers are not invested in EMR software I know a handful of companies that went through YC trying to build EMR software and have met many more people since who are interested in this problem. It is not a lack of interest from engineers.

I was trying to be diplomatic. There are adjectives I wouldn't use to describe developers interested in EMR software. Or at least from my experience from working in that space.

Re: Doctors who use Google Translate to talk to patients want a better option

#156
post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

EMR software, like all medical software, suffers from a variation of the Dead Sea Effect. Those who are truly invested in EMR software are not developers and developers are not invested in EMR software. So, as a developer, it's a job you take because you need a job. And if you're competent, you can get a job elsewhere eventually. If you're not, well, it's not like medical software has a deep talent pool to draw from.…

Besides pay, is there any reason a dev would be more invested in any other B2B app? A few people I know work in medical software, and a lot of them think it's meaningful work.

Doctors are hard to work with. For various reasons. Some understandable, they're often busy all day if they're running a practice. And they need and like days off just as much as anyone. So getting feedback can be tricky.

Then, most of them have superiority complexes. All users think using things makes them usability experts, doctors included. Couple that with the ego that comes with being in a profession where some number are responsible for life and death situations and you wind up with a user who truly believes that making the button cornflower blue is the single most important thing to take this thing over the top.

So you wind up basically with an absent, yet micromanaging, manager who also doesn't know how to develop software. That's kind of soul-crushing.

Re: Doctors who use Google Translate to talk to patients want a better option

#157

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can not buy legitimate painkillers more powerful than Tramadol on the darknet. all legitimate pills have been bought, sold, and removed from the open market, monthes in advanced, years ago.. the safest thing you can buy to treat pain on the internet is tramadol, or, believe it or not, is... black tar heroin. everything else is Fent.

I would not encourage anyone to acquire any opioid medication not prescribed, for a number of reasons. That said, Tapentadol - a cousin of tramadol but much stronger - can be easily bought from Indian and other Asian pharmacies on the clearnet and at affordable prices. One might have a package here and there get seized but all that results in is a snide letter from customs.

So that is what they are putting in the percs now...

thank you, genuinely, it will be looked into.

Re: Doctors who use Google Translate to talk to patients want a better option

#158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People don't choose their native languages and everyone should expect adequate care at a hospital when they need it.

They do choose to move somewhere where their language is not spoken. As stated in this article, the woman was receiving service in Arizona. The official language in that state is English, so you should expect services to be offered in that language.

What an ignorant, cruel, and infuriating position. I remember hearing my grandfather say this exact thing and realizing, at seven years old, that it was not how the world does or should work.

Frustrating that this continues to be an acceptable stance a half century later.

Re: Doctors who use Google Translate to talk to patients want a better option

#159

I can't imagine being a patient in pain trying to communicate that to a doctor who didn't speak the same language, especially when the pain was due to a different issue (as the article describes). The pendulum has fully swung from "pain is a vital sign" to "suck it up" and "anyone who complains about pain is a liar or a drug seeker unless they're older than 65 or have a visible external wound."[1] It's difficult even…

In multi-cultural American this is 100% NORMAL for most immigrants. And has been for 100-200 years. I've heard stories from my grandparents and relatives. My ex's Spanish-only-speaking relatives would talk about it.

This is why immigrants bringing minor children to doctor's appointments as translators is so utterly stereotypical: it actually happens.

It's the next best thing to the alternative by self-preservation - you get creative and put in the work. There's no way to have translators available for any arbitrary doctor - it's too expensive and the language of medical interaction is generally the highest language complexity activity the average person will have to deal with.

I've experienced this while traveling overseas. And you have to prepare for doctor's visits far more than "back home" if you want to get the best care. When I was living in a non-English-speaking neighborhood, I'd have to spend time translating my symptoms to the local language. Without computers, I'd probably need to hand-copy it from a paper dictionary instead. 50 years ago it would be very much a pantomime/charades scenario.

And here's the kicker: talking symptoms is SUPER inaccurate even with both doctor and patient speaking the same language unless the doctor has time and skills for teasing out things the patient doesn't know are relevant. And the doctors on a bell curve of that skill - plenty don't know what they don't know because they are on the low side of the curve so they miss things also.

Re: Doctors who use Google Translate to talk to patients want a better option

#160
post #154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hey! I'm one of those people. I'm building an Ophthalmology EMR. But I do have a question for you at your past job. At Curative were the labs/exams handled on site, or was it partnered with a lab to handle them?

Does your product just cram an ophthalmology scribe into an old sun e10k chassis?

No... but we've beamed a scribe into AWS!
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