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In-flight surgery with a coat-hanger and silverware

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Re: In-flight surgery with a coat-hanger and silverware

#41

Post by brnt »

There's hacking and there is _hacking_.

My sister is training to be a doctor and she has come to dislike the heavily regulated environment we have here in which doctors are not allowed to do anything of this sort. Now, they also don't usually need to, which is a good think, but after she returned from a year in South America, she misses the on-your-feet thinking, creativity and flexibility she could and had to employ to give her patients the care they needed.

I can imagine pulling this off is a great source of satisfaction and validation.

Re: In-flight surgery with a coat-hanger and silverware

#42

Post by mbubb »

marcodiego wrote: post #39
WalterGR wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How does one do that after having a hole cut in one’s chest? Pain-wise.

The hole had lidocaine, a relatively good topic anesthetic. If don't move too much, the tube inside the chest doesn't causes too much pain. Actually, once the tube is inserted the feeling of relief and been able to breath normally is quite good. Disclaimer: I've had 3 spontaneous pneumathoraces.

> 3 spontaneous pneumathoraces…

I remember from EMT school the informal advice that spontaneous pneumo is a predisposition for certain body types and something as trivial as a burp or hiccups can cause. Tall and thin body type. But this is anecdotal- is there an underlying cause in your case?

Re: In-flight surgery with a coat-hanger and silverware

#44

Post by mbubb »

dmurray wrote: post #6
tsm wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The patient was now comfortable, felt well and we retired to our seats to recover. Eight hours later I was again summoned by the stewardess to see the patient, who had developed more chest pain and dyspnoea. > I found her sitting on the toilet with the underwater seal drain on a high shelf. All the water and air had syphoned out of the bottle into the chest. The crisis resolved when I placed the underwater seal dra…

Eight hours! It's hard to believe the woman's condition was critical enough to require invasive surgery with these makeshift tools mid-flight, but so stable post-op that the doctors did not recommend an emergency landing. I understand they recommended against landing pre-op because of worries about cabin pressure, but why not after the surgery? She's going to have to come down at some point.

destination was Delhi - mmaybe no good medical option en route?

Re: In-flight surgery with a coat-hanger and silverware

#45

Post by mbubb »

omegant wrote: post #24

The European rules for emergency medical kit (I guess FAA rules are very similar) also automatic defibrilators are increasingly being included in these kits: CONTENT OF EMERGENCY MEDICAL KITS (a) Emergency medical kits should be equipped with appropriate and sufficient medications and instrumentation. However, these kits should be supplemented by the operator according to the characteristics of the operation (scope o…

expected an AED - wonder if inflight vibration makes it unusable

Re: In-flight surgery with a coat-hanger and silverware

#46

Post by worewood »

brnt wrote: post #41

There's hacking and there is _hacking_. My sister is training to be a doctor and she has come to dislike the heavily regulated environment we have here in which doctors are not allowed to do anything of this sort. Now, they also don't usually need to, which is a good think, but after she returned from a year in South America, she misses the on-your-feet thinking, creativity and flexibility she could and had to employ…

Yeah, but as a South American, one thing is being able to be creative, another is _needing_ to be creative, which means doctors are not being given the resources they need (which is common here).

Re: In-flight surgery with a coat-hanger and silverware

#47

Post by marcodiego »

mbubb wrote: post #42
marcodiego wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The hole had lidocaine, a relatively good topic anesthetic. If don't move too much, the tube inside the chest doesn't causes too much pain. Actually, once the tube is inserted the feeling of relief and been able to breath normally is quite good. Disclaimer: I've had 3 spontaneous pneumathoraces.

> 3 spontaneous pneumathoraces… I remember from EMT school the informal advice that spontaneous pneumo is a predisposition for certain body types and something as trivial as a burp or hiccups can cause. Tall and thin body type. But this is anecdotal- is there an underlying cause in your case?

> spontaneous pneumo is a predisposition for certain body types

Some medics said exactly this for me. This body type is called "franzino" in Brazil and is exactly how I was as a teenager. Strangely my pneumathoraces were not on the same side. On the left side it happened twice which was fixed with two clamps and a pleurodesis. On the right side it occurred only once but considering my predisposition, there's no reason to think it will never happen again.

Re: In-flight surgery with a coat-hanger and silverware

#48

Post by sfe22 »

marcodiego wrote: post #14

I've had an spontaneous pneumothorax when I was a teenager. Had to undergo emergency surgery with only local anesthesia. The surgeon while cutting my chest asked: "You're sure it is this side, right?", which I confirmed. He then said: "Ok, if you're wrong I'm not going to jail alone."

How did you get it. Was it a major accident?

Re: In-flight surgery with a coat-hanger and silverware

#49

Post by _zywo »

brnt wrote: post #41

There's hacking and there is _hacking_. My sister is training to be a doctor and she has come to dislike the heavily regulated environment we have here in which doctors are not allowed to do anything of this sort. Now, they also don't usually need to, which is a good think, but after she returned from a year in South America, she misses the on-your-feet thinking, creativity and flexibility she could and had to employ…

Yeah, but the problem is that some doctors are not capable of doing things of this sort safely, and thus doctor regulations happen. There are definitely unnecessary regulations out there, but I imagine that most of them are simply yet another symptom of "any large enough system eventually gets ruined by abuse".

Re: In-flight surgery with a coat-hanger and silverware

#50

Post by jtbayly »

marcodiego wrote: post #14

I've had an spontaneous pneumothorax when I was a teenager. Had to undergo emergency surgery with only local anesthesia. The surgeon while cutting my chest asked: "You're sure it is this side, right?", which I confirmed. He then said: "Ok, if you're wrong I'm not going to jail alone."

It's a funny quote, but I'm really not sure what the doctor meant...
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