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Deno Is Webby

blog.jim-nielsen.com

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Re: Deno Is Webby

#111

Post by ui4jd73bdj »

antifa wrote: post #94
alerighi wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Removing alert is nonsense, and I don't think they will ever do (without breaking a ton of websites that use it). Why as a developer should I have to make a modal with HTML+CSS+JS to show it to just have a prompt that inform the user about something? Ok, alert is ugly, but for a lot of situations (= industrial software) it's perfectly acceptable.

Why as a user should I have to endure a website with an intrusive user of alert? I don't care what happens to websites that use alert, I never want to see my browser get locked up because of lazy devs wanting to use alerts.

Alert doesn't lock your browser. The developer can spend a lot of time and effort to make an even more intrusive and annoying custom alert.

Why should I as a user have to endure instagram and twitter blocking content with a delayed login prompt that cannot be canceled? Because they can. Browser APIs or not malicious developers will be malicious.

Re: Deno Is Webby

#113

Post by spacemanmatt »

hyperhopper wrote: post #64
spacemanmatt wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's so good I worry about the Betamax effect

What betamax effect? Didn't it fail since the cartridge design was worse and also held less tape than vhs?

No. It failed because JVC saturated the market with incompatible and inferior VHS before Beta could get there.

Re: Deno Is Webby

#114

Post by eyelidlessness »

pvorb wrote: post #88
cxr wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I have spent a fair amount of time over the last several years trying to make node act like the browser, or vice versa. And the right thing to resist doing either. It's to think about what "services" your program actually needs to be able to function and then to isolate those parts from the rest of your application by putting it behind a well-defined interface. In other words, the best way to fix the incompatibilit…

> never make the mistake of coding directly against the host platform's APIs to begin with I regularly read this advice and I think it's bad in general. If you only ever work against an abstraction, you lose time and might get a worse end result than the one without the abstraction. And in the end, you might throw it away, if it doesn't prove successful. So move the cost for working with an abstraction into the futur…

I’m not exactly 50-50 on this, but fairly close. It depends! People talk about ‘premature abstraction’ as if spending any time abstracting up front is premature; others talk about abstractions they find generally useful in such an abstract way that it’s easy to mistake those general findings for rules.

There’s a distinct set of skills and instincts involved in recognizing a generalization of a problem, and a narrower one in recognizing matching solutions which are actually suited to the specific problem. It’s not a skill/instinct everyone has, but it’s not one that should be immediately dismissed either. And one’s recognition of both can grow and be refined over time.

I also think this kind of balanced flexibility should be something we demand as a baseline assumption of the craft:

- We’re going to have instincts no matter what, and we should be encouraged to explore them

- Some of those instincts will prove right, some wrong; often “wrong” will be grey and murky and temporally separated from trying

- When we’ve recognized the error, we should allocate time to correct it with what we’ve learned

- As this process recurses, we should assess whether our predictive senses are getting closer to reality, and adjust our risk impulse accordingly

Re: Deno Is Webby

#115

Post by _carbyau_ »

crate_barre wrote: post #57
triyambakam wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> not promoted as some sort of better alternative to JavaScript, because it's really not. This leaves me skeptical if you have extensive experience with Typescript. It's way more than "oh this is a number not a string." It's "you forgot this property on an object's return type that you built from a response value" or "your Redux reducer doesn't handle all of the possible action types so it will crash at run time"

"your Redux reducer doesn't handle all of the possible action types so it will crash at run time" And what are all these dr. Strange multiverse possibilities you speak of? Any semi seasoned JS dev has spidey sense for watching out for null and undefined, and generally you should know the type of what you are returning. Is there that much variability in what you are dealing with? If it’s an array of objects, that’s no…

I am not a web dev at all but having something for automatic verification (even if limited) sounds more reliable than the variability of any given dev's "spidey sense".

Re: Deno Is Webby

#116

Post by antifa »

______-_-______ wrote: post #96
antifa wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why as a user should I have to endure a website with an intrusive user of alert? I don't care what happens to websites that use alert, I never want to see my browser get locked up because of lazy devs wanting to use alerts.

Alerts haven't locked up the browser since the Bush administration.

Frrl free to update https://stackoverflow.com/questions/8825384/alert-is-bad-rea... with new information.

Re: Deno Is Webby

#117

Post by marcosdumay »

alerighi wrote: post #93
SonOfLilit wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not GP, but I really like [] being false in ruby and python because I often want to ask "is this variable that should hold a collection holding a collection of things, or is it empty/false?"

Why an array with zero element should be false? It doesn't make a lot of sense. And writing if (array.length > 0) is more explicit than writing if (array) anyway. Even in python, I prefer to be explicit and say if len(array) > 0 than to rely on implicit conversion rules.

Personally, I don't like if even accepting things that are not boolean. But an empty array being false makes exactly as much sense as an empty string being false, and both should have always the same behavior.

If you want objects to behave like dictionaries, an empty object should also behave the same, by the way.

Re: Deno Is Webby

#118

Post by westoncb »

lvass wrote: post #66

I'm simply unable of not reacting to someone so exhilarantly rejoicing you don't need a third party library for taking user input with cynicism. Am I living in a bubble, or what the hell went wrong here?

The input prompts are just one example, it's what it's an example of that's actually exciting.

Re: Deno Is Webby

#119

Post by eyelidlessness »

asiachick wrote: post #109
dexwiz wrote: post #4

This is nice, until its not. I have spent a fair amount of time over the last several years trying to make node act like the browser, or vice versa. It's doubly confusing to juniors who don't understand the difference between a language and a runtime. alert() looks like a standard function and should be specified by the ECMAScript Language Specification. But its actually specified by the HTML standard, because its Wi…

Isn't that just basic programmer knowledge. Basic in as "you need to learn the difference between a language and the environment its in". I can run C# in Unity. The number of functions I can call is vastly different than running it outside Unity. I can run Lua in 100s of runtimes, all with different functions available. JavaScript can be used to script Adobe apps. The functions available are different than the browse…

> Isn't that just basic programmer knowledge. Basic in as "you need to learn the difference between a language and the environment its in".

I don’t think the answer to this is boolean. For instance:

> I can run C# in Unity. The number of functions I can call is vastly different than running it outside Unity.

If one is learning both in tandem, coming from a background with a language with different scoping rules, knowing the distinction even exists and should be a consideration might not even show up in reading materials. Sure, it’s an important skill to learn, but it’s not especially transferable. I know how it works in some environments and still find it baffling in others where I even know how to read the code. (Example: Java treats methods as locally scoped functions; I still have no idea how to distinguish them without running the code in a debugger. But I don’t write Java! I have a limited understanding of what’s in scope reading it.)

Re: Deno Is Webby

#120

Post by ______-_-______ »

antifa wrote: post #116
______-_-______ wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Alerts haven't locked up the browser since the Bush administration.

Frrl free to update https://stackoverflow.com/questions/8825384/alert-is-bad-rea... with new information.

That question has been closed and locked since Obama's first term
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