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Gov. Newsom signs law to stop UC Berkeley enrollment cuts

latimes.com

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Re: Gov. Newsom signs law to stop UC Berkeley enrollment cuts

#151

Post by crhulls »

stellar678 wrote: post #146
crhulls wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you talk to the people who grew up here, even the ones who were forced to move due to costs are not supportive of the current affordable housing plans. They want to come back and visit the town they grew up in. For example, I have a caretaker on my property who lives in a trailer and even he doesn't want the plans to go through - he wants the town to stay rural. I'm also on the village association and while almost…

Can you describe a bit more clearly what the state is requiring of towns around Point Reyes? Looking at the top line numbers of the Regional Housing Needs Allocation plan - the Bay Area needs to make space for an additional 440k homes in the next 9 years. Presuming that gets allocated evenly based on population, Point Reyes Station with 1,000 people needs to build about 6 homes per year for the next decade. Even one…

You can look at the Marin County Housing Element (https://www.marincounty.org/depts/cd/divisions/planning/hous...)

The county, based on state mandate, is requiring unincorporated Marin to build in the thousands of housing units. The various districts are each expected to shoulder their burden. The number of housing units the county proposed, via out of town consultants, puts hundreds of units in Point Reyes and Inverness. This is not a conspiracy theory - it is all out there for anyone to see.

And yes, it really doesn't make sense for rural small towns to be housing or job centers. It seems like this is being driven by a misguided sense of equity (e.g. it isn't fair only rich people can live in this nice area).

Re: Gov. Newsom signs law to stop UC Berkeley enrollment cuts

#152

Post by kuang_eleven »

pmalynin wrote: post #36

Next cancel Prop 13, or phase it out over the next 5 years.

We fucking tried. Even Prop 15 to implement a split-roll failed due to truly monumental amounts of bullshit spewed by the defenders of Prop 13, combined with the usual levels of reactionary pearl-clutching of California property owners.

Re: Gov. Newsom signs law to stop UC Berkeley enrollment cuts

#153

Post by crhulls »

morganherlocker wrote: post #137
crhulls wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think there is obviously a balance. The problem is how it is being done. Currently Marin is going through something they call a housing element. They have hired a consultant group from LA to find lots they think would be good and are just rezoning things with a broad brush. I don't think the planners have even been to the county, let alone the town. The plan literally takes some of the vacant parts of town and enco…

> A large number of people who live in the project are people on section 8 and disability with no ties to the region whatsoever. No ties besides… living in said community. How is the disability status of residents relevant to your classification of the project as a failure? Are you advocating for federal housing aid to come with requirements like “locals only” and “non-disabled residents only”?

My point is that people advocate for these projects so the people who can work in the town can live in the town.

So, if someone from out of town who can't work moves in, it undermines the point of the project. In that sense, the disability status is relevant.

I think housing that does require you to work in the community is fair and logical. Otherwise do we just build projects in high end places that essentially just become a lottery for people on government assistance?

Re: Gov. Newsom signs law to stop UC Berkeley enrollment cuts

#154

Post by howinteresting »

sidewndr46 wrote: post #77
paxys wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

More like – legislature passed a law, a certain group of people took advantage of the law in ways the general public didn't intend, the courts said "we have to rule by the letter of the law", legislature amended the law, now most people happy again. This is exactly how the process should work.

I disagree this is not the intended purpose of environmental review laws. The whole point is to allow the citizens themselves to put checks on the unbounded growth of the population and the degradation of the environment as a result. This appears to be politicians attempting to have their cake and eat it too. Environmental review laws are passed specifically because of the concerns raised by the citizens they represe…

Densifying cities does the opposite of degrading the environment, which is why CEQA is so bad.

Re: Gov. Newsom signs law to stop UC Berkeley enrollment cuts

#155

Post by ip26 »

bastawhiz wrote: post #126
crhulls wrote: post #101

I'll share an unpopular opinion, loosely in defense of some elements of NIMBYism. I grew up in a small Marin County town called Point Reyes. It had 350 residents when I grew up, now maybe 1,000. The main reason people live there is to feel remote and rural. It is a way of life. Given the proximity to San Francisco, the real estate prices have skyrocketed. Almost all my blue collar friends have had to move. It is sad…

> Given the proximity to San Francisco, the real estate prices have skyrocketed. Almost all my blue collar friends have had to move. It is sad that we have become a neighborhood for tourists and wealthy tech owner second homes. But, the character of the town remains, which is a nice silver lining. > Forcing a town of I'm not sure what does alter the housing problem if not housing. It seems your position is "don't com…

I think the point is adding 10% more units to Point Reyes dramatically alters the town but increases the total housing supply of greater Marin County by zilch.

Re: Gov. Newsom signs law to stop UC Berkeley enrollment cuts

#156

Post by ip26 »

crhulls wrote: post #101

I'll share an unpopular opinion, loosely in defense of some elements of NIMBYism. I grew up in a small Marin County town called Point Reyes. It had 350 residents when I grew up, now maybe 1,000. The main reason people live there is to feel remote and rural. It is a way of life. Given the proximity to San Francisco, the real estate prices have skyrocketed. Almost all my blue collar friends have had to move. It is sad…

We need a name for the middle ground. Build here, not there. BHNT?

Force a discussion. If we have to build, where should we build, and where should we leave alone?

Re: Gov. Newsom signs law to stop UC Berkeley enrollment cuts

#157

Post by cipheredStones »

crhulls wrote: post #101

I'll share an unpopular opinion, loosely in defense of some elements of NIMBYism. I grew up in a small Marin County town called Point Reyes. It had 350 residents when I grew up, now maybe 1,000. The main reason people live there is to feel remote and rural. It is a way of life. Given the proximity to San Francisco, the real estate prices have skyrocketed. Almost all my blue collar friends have had to move. It is sad…

It's very funny that you wait until the fifth paragraph of your defense of NIMBYism to drop "now, I do possess many, many millions of dollars..."

You're a fan of NIMBYism because NIMBYism is for people like you, who have no reason to worry about the price of housing. Any tradeoff whatsoever of "character" for affordability is bad from your perspective.

Cities and towns change when more people want to live there. They either change by adding more housing, or they change by getting much more expensive and driving out people who can't afford it. If you can always afford it, and "character" to you means the buildings in the area rather than the blue-collar people who used to live there, naturally you prefer the latter.

Re: Gov. Newsom signs law to stop UC Berkeley enrollment cuts

#158

Post by ip26 »

paxys wrote: post #109
crhulls wrote: post #101

I'll share an unpopular opinion, loosely in defense of some elements of NIMBYism. I grew up in a small Marin County town called Point Reyes. It had 350 residents when I grew up, now maybe 1,000. The main reason people live there is to feel remote and rural. It is a way of life. Given the proximity to San Francisco, the real estate prices have skyrocketed. Almost all my blue collar friends have had to move. It is sad…

This isn't an uncommon view, and touches on a lot of fundamental questions that are mostly unanswerable. What is a "town"? Is it comprised of 350 people living in a few houses and all the land which surrounds them? Do they get to decide how this common land should be used? Do they get to decide how private land next to them should be used, whether it belongs to a current resident or not? If person #351 wants to move…

If it’s incorporated, mostly yes. If it isn’t, mostly no.

It’s like HOAs. You are free to do what you want on private land. Except, an HOA is a contract wherein residents mutually agree to limits on that freedom.

Buying property in an HOA or in an incorporated town is buying into that established mutual agreement.

Re: Gov. Newsom signs law to stop UC Berkeley enrollment cuts

#159

Post by stellar678 »

crhulls wrote: post #151
stellar678 wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you describe a bit more clearly what the state is requiring of towns around Point Reyes? Looking at the top line numbers of the Regional Housing Needs Allocation plan - the Bay Area needs to make space for an additional 440k homes in the next 9 years. Presuming that gets allocated evenly based on population, Point Reyes Station with 1,000 people needs to build about 6 homes per year for the next decade. Even one…

You can look at the Marin County Housing Element ( https://www.marincounty.org/depts/cd/divisions/planning/hous... ) The county, based on state mandate, is requiring unincorporated Marin to build in the thousands of housing units. The various districts are each expected to shoulder their burden. The number of housing units the county proposed, via out of town consultants, puts hundreds of units in Point Reyes and Inv…

Thanks for the link, very interesting. The maps that I see are presented as possible candidates for how to meet the housing goals, not a fait-accompli - and they're overwhelmingly concentrated near 101 and the Bay.

I doubt that Marin County is very interested in trying to provide public health and other county services for a bunch of low-income folks moving way out to rural coastal communities. Seems likely that most of the housing going into unincorporated Marin will be smushed right up near 101.

But what about local low-income folks in West Marin like your friends, or the service workers in tourism, hospitality, etc...? Has anybody in your village association talked about what it would take to preserve local control but with a serious commitment for Point Reyes Station to provide housing to meet the needs of local low-income folks?

History has shown that basically once a community exists in California, residents start using local control to blockade housing - with the result being that new housing is mostly built in exurban sprawl by developers who pave over and then subdivide wild lands. These big hammers coming down from the state are basically a self-inflicted wound on the part of supporters of local control.

To provide some personal context: I grew up in the Russian River area. Housing is silly expensive and yet basically nothing gets built, so the towns are turning into retirement/vacation communities. There's roughly no housing that's accessible to people working local jobs, unless you inherited property from your family. I don't think those communities should be sopping up the housing demand for people working in San Francisco, but something's got to push them to build housing for the people who work right there.

Re: Gov. Newsom signs law to stop UC Berkeley enrollment cuts

#160

Post by devoutsalsa »

humanistbot wrote: post #107
crhulls wrote: post #101

I'll share an unpopular opinion, loosely in defense of some elements of NIMBYism. I grew up in a small Marin County town called Point Reyes. It had 350 residents when I grew up, now maybe 1,000. The main reason people live there is to feel remote and rural. It is a way of life. Given the proximity to San Francisco, the real estate prices have skyrocketed. Almost all my blue collar friends have had to move. It is sad…

Your position is indeed unpopular. Everything changes. The population keeps growing. Without development, there isn't enough space for all the kids of all the people you grew up with to stay in Point Reyes and have kids of their own. Also, you don't just live in some random rural town. You live on the most scenic highway in the state, at the exit to a massively popular national seashore, in a major metropolitan area…

At some point the population has to stop growing. There’s not an infinite amount of everything (water, arable land, etc.) If you treat the world like it’s an all you can eat buffet, eventually we’ll be eating faster than the world can fill replenish the buffet, and something else will probably break before we get to that point.
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