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My transition from Windows to Linux in an anti-customer age

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Re: My transition from Windows to Linux in an anti-customer age

#121

Post by m45t3r »

5350-uiop-1130 wrote: post #104
m45t3r wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This comment is strange because the only OS that I never had serious issues with Bluetooth is Linux, specially after migrating to PipeWire. Windows always had some strange driver that were hit or miss depending of the dongle. However macOS is much worse: I have a Galaxy Buds 2 that works perfectly in all my devices (Android, Nintendo Switch, my notebooks running Linux, etc.), but with my work provided MacBook Pro it…

I think the issue is with bluetooth itself. i personally never use it, i find it very flaky at best.

It is definitively not. I mean, Bluetooth is unreliable, but what happens in most of my other devices is a small 1~2 seconds gap in the sound. On macOS it simply stops working until I reconnect my device.

Re: My transition from Windows to Linux in an anti-customer age

#122

Post by diffeomorphism »

Gareth321 wrote: post #112
diffeomorphism wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is servarr in the windows store? If not, it might as well not exist. Just because users have been trained to download .exe's from random, unvetted websites that does not make it any less insane. See android, see iOS (and by now also windows) who all agree how insane that is.

You call easy installation of applications insane. I call convoluted and technically difficult installation insane. I represent the vast majority of PC users, and I don't think you'll ever convince us that a 10 step CLI process to install an application is a good thing.

> Banana monkey dishwasher.

I said windows store is easy, app store is easy, repos are easy. I don't know how you got "10 step CLI process to install" from that and if you just make up random nonsense this "conversation" is worthless.

Re: My transition from Windows to Linux in an anti-customer age

#123

Post by kkfx »

phendrenad2 wrote: post #76
nxbp wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do the settings once. Keep a copy of ~/ and /etc handy. Apply all settings in one go at will. Stop fiddling around, making a fuss about nothing and just keep on using it.

How do you "just keep using" apps that are broken and need lots of fiddling to fix them, often repeatedly after every app update?

Personally I'm using NixOS, sometimes a rebuild is broken, but that's not an issue since I can keep using the old ones in a snap... I'm not using Windows, my last one was XP in it's early days, but anytime for a reason or another I'm on it on someone else desktop the experience is so frustrating that I do not know how it's users can keep using it...

Re: My transition from Windows to Linux in an anti-customer age

#124

Post by kkfx »

My own personal history:

- first machine a dismissed SGI O₂ so Irix/CDE I do not remember witch version

- after few year my first laptop with Windows XP (newly released): I was shocked how limited and bad it is.

- quickly turn to GNU/Linux following some family friend / teachers suggestion, unsatisfied, they were still crap compared to Irix to my eyes

- turn to FreeBSD, hw issues but not much (it was the time from linux 2.4-2.6 passage) I start to breathe a bit

- OpenSolaris then another breathe

- Back to FreeBSD after it's death but too many hw issues, so back again to GNU/Linux, now still on it with NixOS

That short history to state a thing: hw got more and more powerful but also crappy and software keep turning to crap. I think that anti-customer age start right after Xerox/LispM era, even SGI was bad respect of them, they have tried "the unix way" and quickly touch it's limits badly correcting them introducing anti-unix patterns in Unix with GUIs.

In that context my desktop environment is Emacs (EXWM) and while buggy and limited in bootloader OS terms I do not really know how people can keep using "modern GUI", not only Windows since their absurd limits and limitations. The main point is that a desktop must be a flexible tool for the human user, not an endpoint, not a dumb terminal, not a set of know pre-determined by someone else. The rest is noise.

Re: My transition from Windows to Linux in an anti-customer age

#125

Post by Paianni »

pickledcods wrote: post #73

I have a 4k monitor and at first bumped my head into many walls because of the excruciating bad or missing font size/selection support. Tried literally all the desktops and file managers. Ended with Mate/Xfe, both with amazing and consistent font support. Redshift for time dependent colour temperature is also worth mentioning.

Screen size?

Re: My transition from Windows to Linux in an anti-customer age

#126

Post by II2II »

Gareth321 wrote: post #111
II2II wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Radarr sounds like the type of software that no vendor would accept in their app store. Why would you expect it to be available through a Linux package manager? As for the convoluted installation process under Linux, that is on the developer. They can provide packages directly, create a distribution agnostic application, or provide an installer. All of these approaches are in common use under Linux. None of them requ…

>Radarr sounds like the type of software that no vendor would accept in their app store. Why would you expect it to be available through a Linux package manager? I don't. I expect it and many other applications to remain difficult to install, so I expect most users to remain on PC. I am not levelling blame on anyone or anything. I am simply explaining how the user experience is hostile in Linux.

I am going to make a claim that may sound a bit odd to you since it does not reflect your experiences: installing, updating, and removing software is much more user friendly under Linux.

Almost every Linux program I use is available through a package manager. Installing, updating, and removing the software can be done through a graphical package manager that resembles the Windows Store. In an apples-to-apples comparison, I would claim the graphical package manager is more user friendly since it is focuses upon managing software rather than marketing software, but I can appreciate that opinions will differ.

In the case of Linux, most software is available through the package manager. In the case of Windows, a significant portion of software has to be obtained separately. The typical case involves finding the vendor website, downloading the software, then running a multi-step installer. If the software doesn't seek out and install its own updates, the process of updating software is the same. Removal of the software is usually similar to using a package manager under Linux, but there are cases where dependencies must be sought out and removed manually (e.g. Visual Studio). Modern Linux package managers handle dependency removal automatically.

Then there are the still relatively common outliers. Many Windows programs are distributed as zipped files that must be installed manually. Usually this is a case of extracting the files, yet you have to read the instructions to be sure. There are also going to be the uncommon outliers, with installation processes that resemble that of Radarr. (It happens, though I have only seen it with development tools.)

In my experience, the software management frustrations under Linux come from a limited number of outliers. Ironically, those outliers all use installers that resemble their Windows counterparts.

Re: My transition from Windows to Linux in an anti-customer age

#127

Post by draw_down »

jarbus wrote: post #101

A lot of people in this thread seem to suffer with bugs on Linux. In my experience, bugs with systems like WiFi and Bluetooth have been related to the specific hardware I’m using. For my current laptop, I made sure it could run arch with no problems before buying, and I’ve had no issues with WiFi or Bluetooth. That being said, battery life sucks and thunderbolt 3 docks work unreliably.

No post body was provided.

Re: My transition from Windows to Linux in an anti-customer age

#128

Post by mariusor »

shawnb576 wrote: post #43

Every time I try this I go thru standard stages: 1. Ugh I want to run docker natively, Ubuntu looks good, I’ll do that 2. Install latest Ubuntu. It’s great! Love the shell. Hardware works. I can run Windows in Virtual Box for odd apps. 3. Why is my battery life so bad? Why won’t Bluetooth stay connected? 4. I am full Linux. I am living the creed! 5. I am so tired of constantly fixing something. Why is Spotify renderi…

The answers to all your "whys" is: because vendors don't support linux as a first class citizen. It's as simple as that. And why don't they? Because people don't use their wallets enough to support the ones that do.

Re: My transition from Windows to Linux in an anti-customer age

#129

Post by antifa »

phendrenad2 wrote: post #77
sschueller wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I use manjaro a version of arch and I will never go back. Yes, sometimes things to don't but windows has issues as well. I had it with this anti user direction we are going because you know "security reasons". Microsoft decides what is malware, they decide what we are allowed to install, they track everything you do and if you want to turn if off forget it. Everytime you update they try to force you to make a MS acco…

I tried to use Linux but it was a death by a thousand paper cuts of bugs and glitches. I've never experienced Windows stopping me from running a program, maybe you're actually trying to run malware? It's a good idea to install an antivirus or at least windows defender so you can avoid these.

Windows after version 7 is essentially death by a thousand dark patterns, forced surprise updates, forgotten preferences, etc..

Re: My transition from Windows to Linux in an anti-customer age

#130

Post by pizza234 »

Gareth321 wrote: post #110
pizza234 wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> For example, Radarr is an extremely popular tool for managing movies Radarr definitely doesn't represent the status of Linux projects packaging; not providing any package is uncommon. The vast majority of open source projects provide repositories, application packages, binaries (if one wants the latest-and-greatest version; the base repositories of the most common distros typically have almost anything under the su…

"The vast majority" of applications having packages doesn't satisfy my requirement: never ever, for any reason *ever*, having to use the CLI. The requirement is clear, unambiguous, and shared by the vast majority of PC users. For the record, at least in my case, it's certainly not the "vast majority" of applications. The following applications don't have easy to install packages. Even when there is, as in the case of…

By "vast majority" I mean that the standard repositories (which optionally includes extra repositories, like the Canonical Partner one) includes hundreds of thousands of programs, and GUIs are provided by the distro (e.g. the former Ubuntu Software Center).

I've checked several of the programs you've provided, and here's a report:

- Readarr: has docker image(s) in Docker Hub

- PhotoPrism: has docker image(s) in Docker Hub

- Prowlarr: has docker image(s) in Docker Hub

- Openbooks: has docker image(s) in Docker Hub

- Jackett: has native linux binary in the official Github releases

- FlareSolverr: has native linux binary in the official Github releases

- Transmission: it's commonly provided in the Linux distro repositories

Those who refuse to do such a minimal search and/or better look the Github releases page, they definitely deserve to stay on Windows, rather than spreading misinformation.

If a program doesn't to have a package for a given platform (no doubt about those cases), it's a developer's resources problem (and essentially, an O/S popularity one). It'd be ridiculous to say that having to manually install a certain program on Mac is inherent in Mac itself.

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