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Ask HN: How can I prepare for hard economic times?

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71–80 of 341 posts

Re: Ask HN: How can I prepare for hard economic times?

#71
Where do you live? Some of the replies seems to be thinking you are living next to a oncoming zombie apocalypse.

What is your threat model?

Is it losing your savings to inflation? Having it taken away by a corrupt government?

Is it an invasion of the Russians?

Is it losing your job? Or the downfall of society to the point where nobody needs a programmer anymore?

Re: Ask HN: How can I prepare for hard economic times?

#72
Prepare for a recession/market crash? Diversify assets - property, bonds, shares, foreign and local, cash under bed.

Prepare for failure of government/war? Go be a "prepper" - Ie. have a few months worth of food and water stored. (not that hard in tins/pasta/rice). Get small solar panels for phone charging and a gas/wood camping stove. Download wikipedia.

In both cases, prepare to move countries. Often it's better to just leave than try to survive in subpar conditions. Beware that millions of others may be trying to do the same, and lots of governments don't like millions of refugees. Get yourself a passport for another country and you'll be far more likely to be let in.

Re: Ask HN: How can I prepare for hard economic times?

#73

Leave the city.

I'd recommend the contrary: stay or move to the city at least if you can own an apartment. - housing: pick in a flat to keep your energy costs low (neighbors heat one another), and make sure you can walk to a park or a river. Fight to make your city more walkable and bikeable, and support your local businesses. Make sure to live close to people you like or to build new relationship (can't beat cities for that!). I lo…

Excellent advice. Additionally, the house can be owned (and even built) by a housing coop. Most housing coops are meant to build a neighborly community.

Re: Ask HN: How can I prepare for hard economic times?

#74
Diversify in as many areas as you can.

In income terms, diversify away from a single source by learning new skills, training up in areas you're a bit rusty in, learning totally new ones.

In savings or investments: diversify where you put them, spread them around so you're not dependent on any one scenario.

In eating: eat more interesting and cheaper things. Become vegetarian, if you aren't already.

In exercise: drop any gym memberships, use things like body weight to train. Run one day, do yoga the next.

In your media consumption: diversify in sources but don't take this as a cue to read more. Read less, much less, but read better. Ignore social media, it's all b&&&&&t. Find one or two sources of media that are reasonably middle line, and read around a topic in a diverse way. Don't get sucked in to anything, least of all the disaster scenario stuff you'll find.

Last but most important: spend all the time you possibly can with your family. Make them your focus, not your income and "future". Be in the now as much as you possibly can. You'll only have this time with your (small) kids for a very, very short period. They'll be flying off soon. Be there for them.

Best of luck.

Re: Ask HN: How can I prepare for hard economic times?

#75

What country are you based in? In mine (UK) one the biggest outgoing costs is energy, mainly heating. There are various government schemes to help people with recent bills and ways of reducing energy consumption.

The biggest outgoing cost? Are you sure? I would like to see figures for that. I haven't checked the statistics but here in Portugal at least for me the biggest outgoing costs are rents (by a large margin), followed by food. Gas prices and car maintenance costs are also high, whereas public transport is roughly on a par with monthly energy costs. Are people in the UK all heating their homes with electricity?

I guess OP meant it's the biggest outgoing cost after rent and food. (Depending on area, council tax is also pretty high). It has gone up 2-3x in the last few months and now costs as much as food for some people.

Gas heating is common in the UK but a) it's being phased out for eco reasons b) gas has increased in price as well

Re: Ask HN: How can I prepare for hard economic times?

#76
post #37

Been wondering this too without much of a conclusive answer. Gold is already jumped so that is too late. Crypto seems correlated with stocks. I’m counting on a large gap between salary and expenses to save my ass

Something you should do, assuming that your salary is sufficient to allow you to do so, starting after month 3-6 of employment. Live on a budget one level below your means, and build that to two levels over time. Add some months of savings, again if your salary allows, and you should be save.

Re: Ask HN: How can I prepare for hard economic times?

#77

Buy house with few dozens of acres of land. Buy tools to cultivate the land. Buy few sacks of potatoes, learn how to grow them. Buy few sacks of salt, ensure it's stored safely. Learn how to weld with gas, buy enough gas to be stocked. Buy medicines. Buy guns. Buy bullets and vodkas. There are many thing to do to survive in harsh times. But first thing you need to ensure: your own home where you can live; defenses ag…

Has there ever been a time in the last 100 years when this kind of model has been useful. I understand the attraction, but I can't imagine how we could end up in the kind of situation where what you describe would be useful, without say total nucular war, at which point what you describe isn't enough.

Re: Ask HN: How can I prepare for hard economic times?

#78
As someone who's been poor for a long time, first due to tech burnout and then medical stuff, here's some advice:

Budgets are great, if you have steady income. If not, you have to think heuristically rather than algorithmically - how much of my current bank balance has to go to fixed costs like mortgage or rent, food, etc? If the answer is less than 100%, you're already doing better than a lot of people.

Learn to do as much as possible yourself - cook as many meals at home as you can, do your own repairs, make things you need instead of buying them. Invest in tools, because unlike stocks or (God help us) crypto, tools are actually useful in and of themselves. Go find a copy of the old Reader's Digest big yellow DIY home repair manual at a thrift store and keep it.

My rule is, never buy anything new you can get used, never buy anything used you can get for free, never buy anything period you can make, never make anything you can recycle from stuff you already have.

Learn what utilities actually cost in practical terms - how much does it cost to run my AC/heater for an hour? Cook a casserole in the oven? Leave a light on overnight? You'll find yourself actually considering how you use them a lot more. That might sound like Sad grumbling about the heat being turned up above 75°, and maybe it is, but maybe Dad had a point.

The hardest thing to grasp, if you're currently doing well, is how you get locked into survival mode when you're broke. You have to learn how to deal with that, and a lot of people can't. If hard times come, all you will think about is today, and the coming week, and the coming month. There are people who are able to, say, work a low-paying gig 40 hours a week and come home and work on side hustles and entrepreneurial projects - Stephen King working as a teacher and in a laundry and coming home and writing at a tiny desk in his own laundry room. If you're one of those people, you are very fortunate. But the likelihood is that, if you do find yourself in tight financial straits, you will spend your spare time just decompressing from whatever you're doing to try to survive.

Hard times are easier to bear if you've learned to be more self-sufficient and make do without luxuries and do more with less. You've seen that meme from It's Always Sunny In Philadelphia about "old poor" vs "new poor"? That's the difference. New poor is constantly shocked by how hard everything suddenly is, even the things that used to be simple. (A Costco card is not very useful if you live in the middle of the city and can't afford a car, for example. You ain't hauling a year's supply of toilet paper home on a bus.)

Old poor knows all this and is not surprised by how much shit the world can throw at you. Old poor knows that the AA folks have the right idea: you need to accept the things you can't do anything about right now, do what you can about the things you can, and know the goddamn difference.

So really, all of this comes down to reframing your strategies for making it from one paycheck to the next, and adjusting your expectations accordingly.

Also, ditch the streaming services and learn to love The Pirate Bay, and I say that as someone who's made much of his living for most of his life off of creating media. :-D Especially if you've got kids - being able to summon Frozen or Encanto on command even if you can't pay the broadband bill until next week is parental magic. Or so I'm told - I never had kids because I grew up like this and I didn't want to make someone else suffer if they don't have to.

Good luck, man, and if you're doing well now, don't ever forget to be thankful for it. It really comes down to luck most of the time, despite what the nerds will tell you. Being smart and working hard isn't enough, or half the undocumented dudes I've ever known working in the orchards and fields would be living like Kardashians, and all the trustafarians whose parents bootstrapped their crappy useless startup and let them live in the guesthouse rent-free would be standing by the freeway on-ramp with signs that read WILL CREATE INNOVATION IN THE LUXURY TRAVEL SECTOR FOR BEER AND A WARM BED.

Re: Ask HN: How can I prepare for hard economic times?

#79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The biggest outgoing cost? Are you sure? I would like to see figures for that. I haven't checked the statistics but here in Portugal at least for me the biggest outgoing costs are rents (by a large margin), followed by food. Gas prices and car maintenance costs are also high, whereas public transport is roughly on a par with monthly energy costs. Are people in the UK all heating their homes with electricity?

I'd edited my post as you replied. Agree, food generally costs more. Mortgage/rent, highly variable depending on where you live, house big enough etc and if a mortgage, how many years are you able to spread it over. Most UK homes are heated by gas. My recent bill went up 50% to £1500/y. Is expected to increase by 50% again this year.

I see, that makes more sense than your original post. I don't know about mortgage but rents should also be much higher than gas costs nearly everywhere. High rents combined with inadequate salaries seem to be the biggest problem in most industrialized countries.

Re: Ask HN: How can I prepare for hard economic times?

#80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When nobody has money, the first thing governments will go after is land/houses, you can't move/hide them ;) It is a mistake, gold is the only safe bet

Mate they'll go after your gold before they go after your land.

They can't go after something they don't even know you have.
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