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Inspecting Web Views in macOS

blog.jim-nielsen.com

81–90 of 147 posts

Re: Inspecting Web Views in macOS

#81

> Here’s an idea: guess at new features in macOS by using the work of Safari team members as a leading indicator. Shh, please... we don't want WebKit releases to look like xnu releases

Hmmmm. I wonder which OS will support in-kernel JIT for JavaScript first. :v

(/s ... I hope??)

Re: Inspecting Web Views in macOS

#83
post #76
post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A settings view that is largely shared between macOS System Preferences, iOS Settings and icloud.com is not single-platform. Windows Settings uses React Native for the same reason.[1] [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30384494 Edit: mention iOS Settings.

> between macOS System Preferences, iOS Settings Why don’t those both use the same UI toolkit, like the convergent GNU/Linux DEs? (macOS seems to be getting more touch-optimized with each update — eg. making sliders giant and iOS-style; why hasn’t Apple merged Cocoa and Cocoa Touch into one yet?)

You can already use SwiftUI to build apps that work on both macOS and iOS, so the libraries are there, Apple just needs to use.

Re: Inspecting Web Views in macOS

#84
post #76
post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A settings view that is largely shared between macOS System Preferences, iOS Settings and icloud.com is not single-platform. Windows Settings uses React Native for the same reason.[1] [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30384494 Edit: mention iOS Settings.

> between macOS System Preferences, iOS Settings Why don’t those both use the same UI toolkit, like the convergent GNU/Linux DEs? (macOS seems to be getting more touch-optimized with each update — eg. making sliders giant and iOS-style; why hasn’t Apple merged Cocoa and Cocoa Touch into one yet?)

AppKit and UIKit are very different. SwiftUI and Catalyst are the unification efforts, but uptake is gradual. Anyway, once you throw icloud.com into the mix it doesn’t matter.

Re: Inspecting Web Views in macOS

#85
post #2

Awesome! Do you know more Web Views in use?

A lot of Apple apps used to use Web Views on macOS: Messages, Music, TV, App Store, for example. But they have been slowly phased out. Messages in Big Sur, App Store in Mojave, Music and TV in Monterey.

Right now they are only a bunch of settings panels remaining.

Re: Inspecting Web Views in macOS

#86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't quote me on this, but I believe that Apple Music (nee iTunes) has used web views for a long time; probably over a decade. The entire thing probably isn't a web view, but my recollection is that the store components were.

Unsurprisingly the App Store is another example.

App Store was rewritten in 10.14 and it no longer uses a Web View for the main content, some Apple ID setting might still be Web Views.

Re: Inspecting Web Views in macOS

#87
post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd bet that the reason they're using React is because it's cheaper and easier to find front-end developers for the task.

I’ve been hearing this on HN and similar forums for what feels like years now: “Electron/web-based GUIs are only popular because it’s easy to find devs in those ecosystems” Have we considered asking why it’s so much easier to find React devs? Why such a huge, huge majority of UI development today takes place on the web? I’m a front end web developer. I’m very biased. But I’m a little tired of the narrative that “the…

> Perhaps the explanation is that native GUI frameworks simply haven’t kept up in terms of developer experience.

That depends on what one values, in my opinion. Whenever I start poking around with front end web stuff it makes me want to tear my hair out. Not because it isn't technically capable, but it all feels so slapdash, duct-taped, and chaotic compared to what I'm used to writing AppKit/UIKit, even if some aspects of the experience with front end web tech are nicer. Things are solidifying around React which helps, but for me at least, it's still a hard sell to trade away the positive aspects of native development just to get the positive aspects of front end web dev.

Re: Inspecting Web Views in macOS

#88
post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd bet that the reason they're using React is because it's cheaper and easier to find front-end developers for the task.

I’ve been hearing this on HN and similar forums for what feels like years now: “Electron/web-based GUIs are only popular because it’s easy to find devs in those ecosystems” Have we considered asking why it’s so much easier to find React devs? Why such a huge, huge majority of UI development today takes place on the web? I’m a front end web developer. I’m very biased. But I’m a little tired of the narrative that “the…

Seriously, have you TRIED non-web, cross platform, UI dev? It's a nightmare. At least all the things I've tried so far are. I'm trying KDE's Qt IDE out and so far it seems much better at getting a working example built, though it looks like it's missing a visual interface editor. Qt-the-company had a good visual interface editor I used in ~2018 I think with PyQt but I can't find a way to launch it anymore. It's a mess.

Re: Inspecting Web Views in macOS

#89
post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've always wondered why these panes in particular felt like total garbage in comparison to the rest of System Preferences. Now I know!

Confirmation bias!

Tell me you've never used the iCloud preferences in macOS without telling me you've never used the iCloud preferences in macOS.

Re: Inspecting Web Views in macOS

#90
post #88
post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’ve been hearing this on HN and similar forums for what feels like years now: “Electron/web-based GUIs are only popular because it’s easy to find devs in those ecosystems” Have we considered asking why it’s so much easier to find React devs? Why such a huge, huge majority of UI development today takes place on the web? I’m a front end web developer. I’m very biased. But I’m a little tired of the narrative that “the…

Seriously, have you TRIED non-web, cross platform, UI dev? It's a nightmare. At least all the things I've tried so far are. I'm trying KDE's Qt IDE out and so far it seems much better at getting a working example built, though it looks like it's missing a visual interface editor. Qt-the-company had a good visual interface editor I used in ~2018 I think with PyQt but I can't find a way to launch it anymore. It's a mes…

I have, and I found QtQuick and QML to be a better experience for reactive UI programming.
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