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NY energy grid: Real-time dashboard

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Re: NY energy grid: Real-time dashboard

#91

Post by drak0n1c »

woodruffw wrote: post #4

Tangentially related: New York is home to NYPA[1], the largest public power utility/authority in the United States. NYPA is entirely owned by the public, produces some of the cheapest (and greenest) power in the country, and is funded in perpetuity by bonds instead of taxes. Edit: This bond announcement[2] document claims that NYPA provides over 25% of NY's electricity and owns over 30% of the physical delivery infra…

NYPA is unfortunately not green where it counts - their anti-nuclear stance in lockstep with Cuomo has led to NY needing to build three new natural gas power plants to compensate for losses from shuttering nuclear.

https://www.eia.gov/todayinenergy/detail.php?id=47776

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/04/12/nyregion/indian-point-pow...

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-utilities-nypa-energy-ind...

NYPA hasn't been very cheap in recent years either - 45% more expensive than the national average with rates ranging around 18-20 cents/kwh.

https://www.nyserda.ny.gov/Researchers-and-Policymakers/Ener...

Re: NY energy grid: Real-time dashboard

#92

Post by drak0n1c »

primis wrote: post #51

Interesting that the graph of power is split between "Renewables" and "other" which explicitly pulls nuclear out of that equation. NY has currently about 36.5% Renewables right now in their power mix. If they instead labeled it as "Fossil Fuels" and "Non-Fossil Power", the "Non-Fossil" Power production would be 54.3%! Also, I love how constant that Nuclear line is across the generation graph.

Unfortunately, New York is in the midst of a decades-long "Renewables" push to close all of its nuclear plants and replace them with new natural gas power plants.

https://www.eia.gov/todayinenergy/detail.php?id=47776

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/04/12/nyregion/indian-point-pow...

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-utilities-nypa-energy-ind...

Re: NY energy grid: Real-time dashboard

#93

Post by woodruffw »

drak0n1c wrote: post #91
woodruffw wrote: post #4

Tangentially related: New York is home to NYPA[1], the largest public power utility/authority in the United States. NYPA is entirely owned by the public, produces some of the cheapest (and greenest) power in the country, and is funded in perpetuity by bonds instead of taxes. Edit: This bond announcement[2] document claims that NYPA provides over 25% of NY's electricity and owns over 30% of the physical delivery infra…

NYPA is unfortunately not green where it counts - their anti-nuclear stance in lockstep with Cuomo has led to NY needing to build three new natural gas power plants to compensate for losses from shuttering nuclear. https://www.eia.gov/todayinenergy/detail.php?id=47776 https://www.nytimes.com/2021/04/12/nyregion/indian-point-pow... https://www.reuters.com/article/us-utilities-nypa-energy-ind... NYPA hasn't been very c…

Certainly. I wish they would build more nuclear power, invest in more offshore wind farms (NY has plenty of eligible coastline), and all around do just about anything other than build more natural gas plants.

Re: NY energy grid: Real-time dashboard

#94

Post by dpierce9 »

lprubin wrote: post #65

Can anyone explain the dip in power usage between 11am and 4pm? Why would less energy used between those hours?

None of the explanations below are correct. It is warmer but most people don’t have electric heat (resistive or heat pump). Fewer people are home but they are at work and commercial and industrial uses are the largest use. Electricity use peaks midday.

The drop is being caused by solar generation which peaks exactly during those hours. Behind-the-meter solar (and net-metered solar) won’t show up in the aggregate wholesale NYISO generation mix but it will clip demand in exactly the way you see here.

Re: NY energy grid: Real-time dashboard

#96

Post by danans »

tialaramex wrote: post #34
Spooky23 wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I grew up near this NYPA facility, which is a really interesting energy storage idea: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blenheim%E2%80%93Gilboa_Hydroe... Basically, they built a reservoir on top of a mountain, and pump water up there during off peak times. When NYC hits peak demand, they let the water flow down. Essentially a giant water battery!

There are a good few pumped storage sites in the world, here's the one most convenient for me to visit (now that COVID-19 precautions have eased) in Scotland: https://www.visitcruachan.co.uk/ It isn't practical to build mountains, so you need to find some natural mountains you don't mind cutting a big hole into, with a pre-existing lake at the top, at the bottom, or ideally both, and then spend a lot of money buildin…

> It isn't practical to build mountains, so you need to find some natural mountains you don't mind cutting a big hole into

You don't even need a mountain. A hill will do:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ludington_Pumped_Storage_Pow...

Re: NY energy grid: Real-time dashboard

#97

Post by Manuel_D »

danans wrote: post #96
tialaramex wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are a good few pumped storage sites in the world, here's the one most convenient for me to visit (now that COVID-19 precautions have eased) in Scotland: https://www.visitcruachan.co.uk/ It isn't practical to build mountains, so you need to find some natural mountains you don't mind cutting a big hole into, with a pre-existing lake at the top, at the bottom, or ideally both, and then spend a lot of money buildin…

> It isn't practical to build mountains, so you need to find some natural mountains you don't mind cutting a big hole into You don't even need a mountain. A hill will do: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ludington_Pumped_Storage_Pow...

When including inflation, it's delivered at a cost of 2 billion dollars for 19 GWh of storage. $200 per KWh isn't exactly good, it's not even on par with lithium ion batteries.

Re: NY energy grid: Real-time dashboard

#98

Post by adgjlsfhk1 »

jodrellblank wrote: post #85
tialaramex wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It depends, but in some cases certainly. https://www.bmreports.com/bmrs/?q=eds/main That top left graph is showing you the (notional) system price for grid electricity in the UK. The x axis is settlement periods, which are 30 minutes long, thus period 14 on that graph ends 0700 local time, before many people are awake, system price was £0 per MWh. You want it? Have it. The evening peak a few hours ago was £327 per MW…

Is it possible to scale that trade down to something one could do at home, without much equipment and therefore not require much in the way of planning permission? Scale that transaction down 1/3000th to get £100 for the trade. If you could do that every day it would set you up for a yearly pre-tax income of £36k; instead of trading 1GWh the trade would be 333KWh, equivalent to 1.2 Gigajoules. Solve the Pumped Hydro…

you're also not accounting for the fact that the smaller pumps won't be nearly as efficient as big ones.

Re: NY energy grid: Real-time dashboard

#99

Post by adgjlsfhk1 »

dahfizz wrote: post #39
Wowfunhappy wrote: post #18

Why is power produced by wood (which I assume means burning wood) listed alongside solar in "other renewables"? I guess technically trees are renewable? I assume burning them releases CO2 though...

Those trees are farmed for burning. So the wood is renewable - Every X unit of time, the earth renews that supply of wood. Renewable does not mean without carbon dioxide, although this is a carbon neutral process (CO2 taken out of the atmosphere when the trees grow, and released back as they burn).

are you sure? as I understand it, trees are farmed for wood and the waste (twigs, bark, and bits that are not able to be used in construction) are burned.

Re: NY energy grid: Real-time dashboard

#100

Post by Lascaille »

Manuel_D wrote: post #97
danans wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It isn't practical to build mountains, so you need to find some natural mountains you don't mind cutting a big hole into You don't even need a mountain. A hill will do: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ludington_Pumped_Storage_Pow...

When including inflation, it's delivered at a cost of 2 billion dollars for 19 GWh of storage. $200 per KWh isn't exactly good, it's not even on par with lithium ion batteries.

2016 generation: -752 GW/h
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