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Russia opens criminal investigation of Meta over death calls on Facebook

reuters.com

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Re: Russia opens criminal investigation of Meta over death calls on Facebook

#131

Post by brimble »

macinjosh wrote: post #101
MisterBastahrd wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think that part of the problem is that people confuse journalism, which is what reporters at newspapers and people in the field do, and editorialism, which is what normally happens on Fox and CNN. Editorials are not journalism, but when the journalism disagrees with people who are accustomed to the nature of the editorials they enjoy, they then see bias on the part of the journalists instead of the commentators.

Even if an article is written that only contains hard facts there are many ways it can be biased. It could exclude inconvenient facts (this is the most common), it can have inconvenient information at the end of the article where most people don't read. Some news can also just be ignored. Some parts of a story are never surfaced simply because no one cares about it or knows about it. Journalists are flawed humans lik…

Simply choosing what gets reporter time or page space or air time or whatever introduces huge bias, even if the coverage itself is meaningfully "objective". Listen to NPR (let alone anything else) and you'd think there's rarely labor action happening. Listen to Democracy Now and you'd think there's constantly labor action happening.

Re: Russia opens criminal investigation of Meta over death calls on Facebook

#132

Post by mensetmanusman »

tonetheman wrote: post #48

I mean Facebook/Meta did not care that they helped genocide in Myanmar https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2021/dec/06/rohingya-... I cannot imagine they will care about Russia either.

Failure to act.

Re: Russia opens criminal investigation of Meta over death calls on Facebook

#133

Post by shihab »

Bouncingsoul1 wrote: post #111
at-fates-hands wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interesting observation. . . When Crimea was annexed, there were many articles on Azov Battalion and the implications that it was the best thing (capable fighters who will defend the country) and the worst thing (they're Fascists) and how that would play out if Russia invaded. Since the invasion, I haven't seen any articles on the topic and the US media have gone suddenly silent on their involvement. I find it kind o…

"Since the invasion, I haven't seen any articles on the topic and the US media have gone suddenly silent on their involvement." that's just not true pick your favourite search engine and you see articles on this topic from every major outlet.I checked for this Nyt, WP (US) , der spiegel(ger), guardian(uk). You see articles coming up the last 2 weeks, another spike was 2017 and before 2014. I guess if ran an analysis…

You're right, and yet I disagree with your main point. For every article about Azov or other far-right nationalists, there are like 100 saying Russia is spreading misinformation about Nazism in Ukraine (which can of course be true too). The ratio is not appropriate in my very subjective opinion.

Another point about you mentioning The Guardian- I've always found before, specially so during this conflict, British media presents comparatively balanced narrative than American ones. Chomsky's "Manufacturing Consent" is being staged right in front of our eyes.

Re: Russia opens criminal investigation of Meta over death calls on Facebook

#134

Post by themgt »

nindalf wrote: post #110
gambler wrote: post #40

If you need to change your platform's rules for literally every major event (elections, Covid, this war) there is something profoundly wrong both with your rules and your platform. There is tremendous value in having actual principles. So many people either forgotten it or never understood that to begin with.

Feel free to suggest different rules. Start with the publicly accessible “Community Standards” and edit it to the point where they are consistent and comprehensive in your book with no special cases. We’ll wait. In reality what you might find is that even some obvious rules like “no naked pictures of obvious minors (<10 years) should be allowed” have exceptions to it. And if you can’t reason why this is true (I’m thi…

"Completely objective and fair rules are impossible, so Calvinball it is" is not a credible stance.

Facebook's big recent decisions have been:

* posting news articles about Hunter Biden's laptop: banned

* posting about possible Covid lab leak: banned

* calling for death of Russians: thumbs up

* praising Azov neo-Nazis: thumbs up

Their consistent and comprehensive principle is just serving TPTB. Let's not dress it up beyond that.

Re: Russia opens criminal investigation of Meta over death calls on Facebook

#136

Post by xdennis »

vogre wrote: post #54
concinds wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are correct. "We won't allow credible calls for violence against Russian civilians," says Meta. https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2022/mar/11/facebook-... They define credible as: having two "indicators of credibility", such as location or method. That is a considerably higher bar than for any other group. And that's referring to civilians, not soldiers. In a separate, internal memo, they explicitly say that…

> violent speech against Russian civilians is allowed "if the context is the Russian invasion" So it's possible to say "Russia is invading Ukraine, so every Russian must die"? Also >Emails also showed that Meta would allow praise of the Ukrainian far-right Azov battalion, which is normally prohibited. You can praise nazis when they are on your side?

> You can praise nazis when they are on your side?

In WW2 Finland was allied with Nazi Germany because the Soviet Union invaded them.

The UK was allied with the Soviet Union because the Nazis invaded them.

You don't have the luxury the choose your friends when the enemy is blowing up your children.

Re: Russia opens criminal investigation of Meta over death calls on Facebook

#137

Post by pessimizer »

therealjumbo wrote: post #99
MisterBastahrd wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, they didn't. That's my point. One of the most famous scenes in US TV News history was when Walter Kronkite, America's news daddy, finally had enough regarding the bullshit peddled by national television networks regarding the Vietnam war. It was NEVER unbiased. People love to believe that the news USED to be unbiased because the news produced at the time reconciles with their memory of the events they want to bel…

Biased and manipulated news is a spectrum like security. You can find instances of anything in the past of you look hard enough. We are currently in a time of more bias and manipulation than the 60s/70s. Additionally, pointing out that Facebook lacks any fundamental principles and is just a reed in the wind is a great observation.

> We are currently in a time of more bias and manipulation than the 60s/70s.

No, we are not.

Re: Russia opens criminal investigation of Meta over death calls on Facebook

#138

Post by twelve40 »

sAbakumoff wrote: post #127

So, Russian authorities are going to label Meta an “extremist organization” and if one participates in such organization, f.e. has an account on Facebook, then it's a crime. Fcking brilliant.

this is false https://www.kp.ru/daily/27375.5/4557218/

Re: Russia opens criminal investigation of Meta over death calls on Facebook

#139

Post by pessimizer »

MisterBastahrd wrote: post #63
mancerayder wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think principles went out the window when both the new generation and journalists decided: "You can't stay still on a moving train." I.e., everything is biased, no one is objective, and no platform can be objective because everything has an implicit position (even no position is a position). In other words, a very postmodern "no objective truth can be obtained" take. So yes, the rational, logical next step is loose…

I find it fascinating that people believe that there was ever an unbiased, objective news media. This literally has never been the case in the total history of the industry. Journalists are paid to contextualize the data they find, not to regurgitate it.

And even when they're regurgitating, they're regurgitating something written by a PR pro.

Re: Russia opens criminal investigation of Meta over death calls on Facebook

#140

Post by moltke »

monklu wrote: post #82
gambler wrote: post #40

If you need to change your platform's rules for literally every major event (elections, Covid, this war) there is something profoundly wrong both with your rules and your platform. There is tremendous value in having actual principles. So many people either forgotten it or never understood that to begin with.

On the contrary, I think this says less about FB, but more so reflects a hypocrisy in "western principles" that many are probably not self-aware of. Let's assume for a second, that FB do not relax their rules for this conflict. Then they would have to ban a whole sleuth of Ukrainian accounts, including many government accounts such as Ministry of Defense, and probably even Zelensky. You don't have to stretch your ima…

These "Western Principles" are primarily what separate us from Russia. Without those who cares which government we live under?
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