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Don't ask to ask, just ask (2019)

dontasktoask.com

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Re: Don't ask to ask, just ask (2019)

#41

Post by thenerdhead »

IgorPartola wrote: post #32
thenerdhead wrote: post #28

This advice applies best in business settings. Business is transactional and it's very rare that someone wants to "get to know you". Those who do, will let you know by getting more involved or talking to you outside of these types of requests, not just out of the blue. I'm a huge fan of no hello & "just ask" in our future world of async work. https://sbmueller.github.io/nohello/

The opposite applies in interpersonal relationships. There you should ask to ask every time: “Hey John can I ask you about your ex Gina? If now is not a good time, let me know when.” John might not want to talk about Gina. Or he might not want to talk about an emotional issue before a big meeting at work. Or he might want to know what exactly you want to know and establish parameters of the conversation before diving…

Great point!

Re: Don't ask to ask, just ask (2019)

#42

Post by dap »

corobo wrote: post #9

This feels like one of those internet rules that stems from a neurodiverse IRC-type crowd Neurotypical people use this sort of social foreplay as a way to handshake a conversation[1], where the tech types want an input/output process devoid of mood and feeling It is silly and quite time wasting online too, but it's what they need to feel comfortable asking you questions. I figure if they need to adapt to some of my q…

Yeah, I don’t think it’s just lazy or social habit that causes people to do this. Particularly when it’s an outsider (eg a sales person in an engineering team’s chat room) in a situation where some response is expected (eg a work environment), it can seem presumptuous to dump a question that will require a bunch of time to engage with. Asking to ask expresses “I realize I’m asking for a bunch of your time here and it’s okay if you don’t want to help [even if you could]” and it gives the room a chance to decline the question before getting far enough into it that it would appear rude to bail out.

I’m guessing a bit here from what I’ve seen. I don’t think this stuff is conscious. But I don’t feel like the authors of stuff like this are even trying to have empathy for why people do this.

Re: Don't ask to ask, just ask (2019)

#43

Post by mkr-hn »

jagged-chisel wrote: post #34
bluefirebrand wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For me it's not because I want an input/output type conversation, it's because I want to maintain asynchronous conversation. If I reply "I'm fine thanks how are you" then you know I'm here and looking, you've forced me to into a synchronous conversation and now I will appear rude if I don't immediately answer your "I just have a quick question" If you just post your question upfront, I can read it and prioritize it m…

I'm the 'engineer' side of the equation. But often I need async interaction with various others. So I just combine it all in one message: Hey, Jo! I just have a quick question for when you have a moment: And leave it. I'll ping Jo again at a time interval depending on urgency - sometime this sprint? I'll remind about the message in a couple days. Need it today? I indicate that when I ask, and about 4hrs later I'll po…

This is 100% it.

Expectation setting is the missing key in a lot of these conversations. Asking to ask is about not being rude. There are better ways to do this in an asynchronous conversation. It's right up there with "we need to talk" in texts. The anxiety it causes is completely unnecessary, and easily avoided with a little detail and priority.

There are countless socially defined, implicit hammers looking for nails. Most can be improved upon or swapped out for different tools.

Re: Don't ask to ask, just ask (2019)

#44

Post by hypertele-Xii »

Don't answer the question, provide the information the asker needs.

This is a vital design and engineering skill. Clients come to you with solutions they themselves came up with, but you're supposed to query their underlying problem and offer a better solution.

Re: Don't ask to ask, just ask (2019)

#45

Post by alecbz »

> ..which is just lazy. If you're not willing to do the work to solve your problem, why should we?

Eh, don't think I agree here. The initial ask is low-effort but so is the initial response expected ("I could help, what's up?"). It seems fair to want to aim for something like:

    A: low effort ask
    B: low effort response
    A: high effort ask now that you know someone's listening
    B: high effort response
to avoid things like:

    A: high effort ask  
    (no one's around, effort wasted)

Re: Don't ask to ask, just ask (2019)

#46

Post by [deleted] »

corobo wrote: post #9

This feels like one of those internet rules that stems from a neurodiverse IRC-type crowd Neurotypical people use this sort of social foreplay as a way to handshake a conversation[1], where the tech types want an input/output process devoid of mood and feeling It is silly and quite time wasting online too, but it's what they need to feel comfortable asking you questions. I figure if they need to adapt to some of my q…

[deleted]

Re: Don't ask to ask, just ask (2019)

#47

Post by [deleted] »

alecbz wrote: post #45

> ..which is just lazy. If you're not willing to do the work to solve your problem, why should we? Eh, don't think I agree here. The initial ask is low-effort but so is the initial response expected ("I could help, what's up?"). It seems fair to want to aim for something like: A: low effort ask B: low effort response A: high effort ask now that you know someone's listening B: high effort response to avoid things like…

[deleted]

Re: Don't ask to ask, just ask (2019)

#48

Post by gondo »

Sometimes you have to adjust the amount of information you are allowed to disclose depending on who you are talking to. And you don't want to exclude people based on this as any amount help can move you forward.

Re: Don't ask to ask, just ask (2019)

#49

Post by tablespoon »

corobo wrote: post #9

This feels like one of those internet rules that stems from a neurodiverse IRC-type crowd Neurotypical people use this sort of social foreplay as a way to handshake a conversation[1], where the tech types want an input/output process devoid of mood and feeling It is silly and quite time wasting online too, but it's what they need to feel comfortable asking you questions. I figure if they need to adapt to some of my q…

> It is silly and quite time wasting online too, but it's what they need to feel comfortable asking you questions...

No necessarily. Asking "Any Java experts around?" takes little effort, while formulating a question for a Java expert could take significant effort. A "no" response for the first question could save everyone from wasting their time with the second.

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