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Why does Google use location for language rather than browser settings?

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Re: Why does Google use location for language rather than browser settings?

#151

Post by littlecranky67 »

makeitdouble wrote: post #46
Cthulhu_ wrote: post #40

I built an iOS app once for a Dutch audience. We used the device's language as the app's language, because that makes sense, right? It's the same with the preferred language in a browser, right? Wrong; we got complaints from users that their app was in English instead of Dutch. Even though their device was set to English or another unsupported language. We begrudgingly added an app specific language preference. I rep…

First and foremost, thanks for having a very sane approach to this ! This is what other apps should tend to. > We used the device's language as the app's language, because that makes sense, right? One of the mistake devs do all the time is assuming users use _one_ language. It’s not the case for a very large portion of people around the globe.

Yepp, just look at other responses here in this thread. People often assume that there is a system language that is used in the browser; that is only partly true, browser settings allow to specify multiple languages with given priority. It is just usually the default system language, until you configure it. The browser might not even use the system language in that setting at all if you configure otherwise.

Re: Why does Google use location for language rather than browser settings?

#153

Post by ProblemFactory »

m_st wrote: post #58
jakub_g wrote: post #4

The article talks about Microsoft, and boy, it's even more terrible in some respects: for example, language of some Office tools like Excel is bound to the organization ! I worked for a French company, and I was forced to use web Excel in French, including keyboard shortcuts being FR-specific ("ctrl-g" for "bold" - "grossir"). I had my language set to English everywhere in browser, OS, MS profile, Office profile etc.…

Regarding Excel: Watch out with multi language setups! I was working with an English iPhone, an English Windows PC and a Swiss German Mac on an Excel file stored on One Drive. Editing sometimes in Excel and sometimes in Excel Online. Result: Broken data due to SUM/SUMME/etc formulas, broken phone number recognition and (worst) broken dates. What a mess!

And broken CSV files.

In some European locales Excel switches from importing/exporting Comma Separated Values to Semicolon Separated Values with comma acting as the decimal point.

Re: Why does Google use location for language rather than browser settings?

#154

Post by aeyes »

mbustamanter wrote: post #129
arepublicadoceu wrote: post #22

My personal papercut is with YouTube. It doesn’t care that: - my browser is in English - that I’m logged in and with English as my language - that my region is set to the U.S. - that I only used English keywords on the search box It still gives me Portuguese results as my geo ip is in Brazil. It’s infuriating.

Same, but with Spanish. My first language is Spanish but 99% of the media I consume is in English. Each time I log into YouTube my location is set to Chile and language to Spanish. Each time I change them to US and English. I've even sent complaints but nothing ever happens.

That doesn't happen to me, I can open YouTube in incognito mode and the UI is in English. I'm not using a VPN. So it surely has to be your browser or OS settings.

google.com on the other hand is Spanish.

Re: Why does Google use location for language rather than browser settings?

#155

Post by tzot »

petepete wrote: post #74
makeitdouble wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Behavior is different if you’re logged in and depending on your settings I think.

There's just so many things at play it's really difficult to know what to blame. When I ask Google Assistant "where am I?" on my phone it tells me I'm in Manchester. Nice. When I ask the same question on my Bluetooth headphones it says Liverpool. I can't get it to work. It's been like that for a year. Can't get any support. So I just don't use Assistant for anything.

> When I ask Google Assistant "where am I?" on my phone it tells me I'm in Manchester. Nice.

> When I ask the same question on my Bluetooth headphones it says Liverpool. I can't get it to work. It's been like that for a year. Can't get any support.

Maybe Google's own analytics suggest that very few people in Manchester use Bluetooth gadgets, ergo you are in Liverpool.

Or (more seriously even if as unlikely perhaps) maybe you have a duplicate Bluetooth MAC address, the other one located in Liverpool. Do you have Bluetooth turned on when not using your headphones? Does the answer depend on Bluetooth being on?

Re: Why does Google use location for language rather than browser settings?

#156

Post by Someone »

usrusr wrote: post #96
justinmayer wrote: post #70

I met one-on-one with Google’s senior leadership in 2000 to talk about their internationalization efforts. This was very early in their trajectory, so I even sat down with Larry Page and chatted with him for half an hour. A year or two later I’m in Tokyo and talk to a new Google product manager based there. I tell her it is insane that Google serves me Japanese pages on my English-configured PowerBook just because I…

The ad market for lang=x, location=y must be abysmally small, even for tourist destinations. When you pretend that you didn't notice that the user is not a local you can still bill the impression and most importantly the occasional accidental click as a "mission accomplished".

The fraction of site visitors who are tourists may be low, but I expect it to be a segment with relatively more money that also is in the mood to spend on certain things. Looks like an audience google can charge more for.

Re: Why does Google use location for language rather than browser settings?

#158

Post by lostcolony »

littlecranky67 wrote: post #149
mcv wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> These users will still want Google to return results in their native language. Says who? This is a baseless assumption. Just listen to the settings that specify what language the user wants. That's what it's for. And the browser should ask the OS or the user for their language preference. And if IT-support wants one language for the interface in order to facilitate support, they can still set the other language for…

> Says who? The browser setting that every browser sends to any server it requests data from. Usually this defaults to the system language, but you can add more languages with a priority. Mine is English (prio 1), German (prio 2), yet I for some reason get tons of spanish content as I am going back and fourth between countries these days just based on Geolocation.

I think you're indirectly agreeing with the parent (and great-grandparent); both are saying "Google (and others) shouldn't just use the IP; use the browser's language setting, and if that hasn't been set, the OS setting", which you also seem to be agreeing with.

The only one differing is the grandparent, which was asserting first that users might think showing anything other than the local language is an error, and then asserting that users want their native language, and so I'm not really certain what they're asserting since those two are not always the same (maybe that the first is the reason Google does it, the second is asserting the preferred behavior, which is nearly agreement, in that the latter is doable via OS or browser preferences).

Re: Why does Google use location for language rather than browser settings?

#159

Post by disruptiveink »

rescbr wrote: post #68
Cthulhu_ wrote: post #40

I built an iOS app once for a Dutch audience. We used the device's language as the app's language, because that makes sense, right? It's the same with the preferred language in a browser, right? Wrong; we got complaints from users that their app was in English instead of Dutch. Even though their device was set to English or another unsupported language. We begrudgingly added an app specific language preference. I rep…

And then there's the technical audience: I use all my devices in English, as usually the translations are subpar. On the other hand, I expect the local apps (ie, banking, some e-gov app, your package shipping example, etc) to be in my native language, as usually, the translations are even worse due to the developer's budget allocated to localization. Conversely, when I'm travelling and need to use some local app (air…

That's exactly my approach as well. My devices are usually in English, as it's the "lingua franca" of the OS and the internet. For non country-specific applications, it's much harder to search for, well, any issue if your OS/browser/IDE/complex application is not in English.

On the other hand, I want my local apps to use the local language, as they were developed with the native language in mind first for a use case that makes sense with that specific locale in mind, and it just doesn't make sense to be reading an English translation of something that you're used to see expressed in your local language. An English translation in that case is usually not only subpar but confusing if you're also fluent in the local language.

My ideal would be to somehow state that, say, "I speak English and German. My preference is to have content displayed in what you consider the "native" language of your application if it's on that list, otherwise my preference is English, then German."

In practice, no one would bother setting this up (as we see in the case of Accept-Language) and no one would bother implementing this correctly. The next best thing is just an application/website specific language override, which is easily explainable to any user.

Re: Why does Google use location for language rather than browser settings?

#160

Post by somedude895 »

justinmayer wrote: post #70

I met one-on-one with Google’s senior leadership in 2000 to talk about their internationalization efforts. This was very early in their trajectory, so I even sat down with Larry Page and chatted with him for half an hour. A year or two later I’m in Tokyo and talk to a new Google product manager based there. I tell her it is insane that Google serves me Japanese pages on my English-configured PowerBook just because I…

Businesses usually put out their SEA ads in only the local language. All the people who have their device language set to one different from the current country's language won't see those ads. I could see that being a reason.
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