Moscow retaliates against Western sanctions with export bans • Hacker News Board

Re: Moscow retaliates against Western sanctions with export bans

#81

Post by dragonwriter » Thu, Mar 10, 2022, 5:46 PM UTC

vnchr wrote: post #36

sandworm101 wrote: post #30

The Iron Curtain cut through the heart of Europe, dividing east from west. Curtain 2.0 looks to be forming only around Russia, walling it off from all of Europe. Things will be so much worse for people on the inside this time. It will be like Soviet Russia without the Warsaw Pact to support it. It is one thing to be without Twitter and Hollywood movies, but can Russia feed itself? Can any country? Modern industrial a…

They’ve got plenty of opportunities with China.

There have been a number of negative indicators on that front in the last couple days, most recently:

https://www.reuters.com/business/aerospace-defense/russia-sa...

Re: Moscow retaliates against Western sanctions with export bans

#82

Post by farseer » Thu, Mar 10, 2022, 5:47 PM UTC

sandworm101 wrote: post #30

The Iron Curtain cut through the heart of Europe, dividing east from west. Curtain 2.0 looks to be forming only around Russia, walling it off from all of Europe. Things will be so much worse for people on the inside this time. It will be like Soviet Russia without the Warsaw Pact to support it. It is one thing to be without Twitter and Hollywood movies, but can Russia feed itself? Can any country? Modern industrial a…

With the amount of land and oil they have, food would never be an issue. Even an isolated Russia can conjure up basic lorries and tractors. The real question is would ordinary Russians be content in life without most modern amenities? Sure they can barter their natural resources in exchange for goodies from China but at what price?

Re: Moscow retaliates against Western sanctions with export bans

#83

Post by nickthegreek » Thu, Mar 10, 2022, 5:48 PM UTC

jquery wrote: post #47

sandworm101 wrote: post #30

The Iron Curtain cut through the heart of Europe, dividing east from west. Curtain 2.0 looks to be forming only around Russia, walling it off from all of Europe. Things will be so much worse for people on the inside this time. It will be like Soviet Russia without the Warsaw Pact to support it. It is one thing to be without Twitter and Hollywood movies, but can Russia feed itself? Can any country? Modern industrial a…

All of this stops the day Russia stops attacking Ukraine, it’s not like Russia is a helpless victim here. Edit: I agree there will be reverberating consequences. Criminals have to pay their debt to society. Russia is already deep in a hole. Even if this war stops today, their economy is set back many years. The economic might of the peaceful world is being used to make an example of a warmongering nation. But Russia…

Even if the sanctions stop, I don't know if all the companies that left will come back the next week, month or year. There is restitution that needs to happen.

Re: Moscow retaliates against Western sanctions with export bans

#84

Post by tinus_hn » Thu, Mar 10, 2022, 5:49 PM UTC

kriops wrote: post #2

Maybe someone can enlighten me, but is this not the equivalent of saying "You can't fire me - I quit"? Are there any practical consequences from this besides symbolism?

Neither Russia nor the West is stopping trade in everything. This action means Russia is taking the initiative so they can choose what trade is banned. Of course that’d be trade in something the West needs.

Re: Moscow retaliates against Western sanctions with export bans

#85

Post by TheSpiceIsLife » Thu, Mar 10, 2022, 5:49 PM UTC

jquery wrote: post #47

sandworm101 wrote: post #30

The Iron Curtain cut through the heart of Europe, dividing east from west. Curtain 2.0 looks to be forming only around Russia, walling it off from all of Europe. Things will be so much worse for people on the inside this time. It will be like Soviet Russia without the Warsaw Pact to support it. It is one thing to be without Twitter and Hollywood movies, but can Russia feed itself? Can any country? Modern industrial a…

All of this stops the day Russia stops attacking Ukraine, it’s not like Russia is a helpless victim here. Edit: I agree there will be reverberating consequences. Criminals have to pay their debt to society. Russia is already deep in a hole. Even if this war stops today, their economy is set back many years. The economic might of the peaceful world is being used to make an example of a warmongering nation. But Russia…

Predicting the future is hard.

I imagine there'd be much pressure for Putin to resign, or age-out, and a calmer leader to ascend, before significant forward progress is made in healing relations.

Re: Moscow retaliates against Western sanctions with export bans

#86

Post by [deleted] » Thu, Mar 10, 2022, 5:51 PM UTC

smhenderson wrote: post #15

Anyone know what impact these two items from the article would have on western companies? allowing Russian airlines to register jets leased from Western firms as their own property In response, a government commission on Wednesday approved the first step towards nationalising assets of foreign firms that leave the country. It seems to me the companies involved probably knew this was possible/probable when they pulled…

[deleted]

Re: Moscow retaliates against Western sanctions with export bans

#87

Post by dragonwriter » Thu, Mar 10, 2022, 5:51 PM UTC

sAbakumoff wrote: post #26

toyg wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If they extend them to gas, we Euros are fucked hard.

how would they pay for the war if they don't sell gas to us in Europe? Besides, the EU presented the plan to get rid of the RU gas dependency: https://www.theverge.com/2022/3/8/22967244/european-union-ru...

> how would they pay for the war if they don't sell gas to us in Europe?

Degraded capacity and suffering of the Russian people, mostly. The consumables they can build they will, everything else will get used up in the hope that the war is won before the capacity to fight it is fully degraded, and that once there is a fair accompli in Ukraine, a sufficient subset of the world will see no point in further sanctions and they’ll be able to use the expanded economic power from their victory to build back.

(I don't think it's a good plan, but it's all they have left.)

Re: Moscow retaliates against Western sanctions with export bans

#88

Post by citrin_ru » Thu, Mar 10, 2022, 5:51 PM UTC

pinewurst wrote: post #32

smhenderson wrote: post #15

Anyone know what impact these two items from the article would have on western companies? allowing Russian airlines to register jets leased from Western firms as their own property In response, a government commission on Wednesday approved the first step towards nationalising assets of foreign firms that leave the country. It seems to me the companies involved probably knew this was possible/probable when they pulled…

Though what's the value of an unsupported modern jetliner?

It looks like a pure retaliation - to make western leasing companies to suffer losses. What to do with the planes I think no-one thinks at this stage. They may use them for scrap metal if will not find a better use.

Re: Moscow retaliates against Western sanctions with export bans

#89

Post by pg_1234 » Thu, Mar 10, 2022, 5:51 PM UTC

dalbasal wrote: post #80

sandworm101 wrote: post #30

The Iron Curtain cut through the heart of Europe, dividing east from west. Curtain 2.0 looks to be forming only around Russia, walling it off from all of Europe. Things will be so much worse for people on the inside this time. It will be like Soviet Russia without the Warsaw Pact to support it. It is one thing to be without Twitter and Hollywood movies, but can Russia feed itself? Can any country? Modern industrial a…

They can probably feed themselves. Growing calories is something we're good at, especially Russia. The hard part is dealing with a scenario where there is plenty of wheat, but people have no money to buy it. Ireland, in the 1840s suffered a horrific famine. Grain was being exported the while time. Food existed. People couldn't afford it. During the US' great depression, people were hungry while agricultural products…

Well, the wheat will be affordable because Russia won't be able to export it.

Re: Moscow retaliates against Western sanctions with export bans

#90

Post by philipkglass » Thu, Mar 10, 2022, 5:51 PM UTC

zdragnar wrote: post #10

kriops wrote: post #2

Maybe someone can enlighten me, but is this not the equivalent of saying "You can't fire me - I quit"? Are there any practical consequences from this besides symbolism?

Some few Russian products are in high demand. Natural gas, as others have said. Russia is the third biggest supplier of nickel, and iirc the biggest supplier of high grade nickel- a key component in many applications, not the least of which is in lithium batteries. London recently had to suspend nickel trading because the price was astronomically high. There will be no getting off of fossil fuels without nickel, and…

Lithium iron phosphate batteries are a type of lithium ion battery that does not require nickel or cobalt. They're already used in many electric vehicles including standard-range Tesla vehicles. They're also a preferred choice for grid scale storage because the modestly lower energy density of LFP chemistry doesn't matter for a battery that sits in one place for years.