Live data from Hacker News

Apple M1 Ultra

apple.com

461–470 of 855 posts

Re: Apple M1 Ultra

#461

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But it's still impossible to replace RTX 3090 with this new Mac Studio because games just will not run on MacOS.

Maybe Valve can port proton to mac

That would not help. The reason proton works so well is because Linux on x86 and Windows on x86....are both on x86.

Proton on ARM Mac's would involve Rosetta and while that does a surprisingly good job of running x86 on ARM I'm not sure it's up to the job of running games at high speed...

Re: Apple M1 Ultra

#462
post #230

Is it actually more powerful than a top of the line threadripper[0] or is that not a "personal computer" CPU by this definition? I feel like 64 cores would beat 20 on some workloads even if the 20 were way faster in single core performance. [0] https://www.amd.com/en/products/cpu/amd-ryzen-threadripper-3...

My workstation has a 3990x. Our "world" build is slightly faster on my M1 Max. https://twitter.com/kiratpandya/status/1457438725680480257 The 3990x runs a bit faster on the initial compile stage but the linking is single threaded and the M1 Max catches up at that point. I expect the M1 Ultra to crush the 3990x on compile time.

Are both cases compiling to the same target architecture? If not, you may well be comparing the relative performance of different compiler backends instead of comparing the performance of your CPUs.

(+ now I see it's rust: how parallel is your build, really?)

Re: Apple M1 Ultra

#463
post #447
post #307

This is insane. They claim that its GPU performance tops the RTX 3090, while using 200W less power. I happen to have this GPU on my PC and not only it costs over $3000, but its also very power-hungry and loud. Currently, you need this kind of GPU performance for high resolution VR gaming at 90 fps, but its just barely enough. This means that the GPU will run very loudly and heat up the room, and running games like HL…

Ehh, I wouldn't put too much stock in graphs of "relative performance" on a 0-200 scale like these. Marketing can cook up whatever they like when they want to make a product look good. Wait for actual benchmarks before trying to judge the product. Their base claim is >2x the m1 max, which is still nowhere close to the performance of a 3090. Apple's footnotes don't even pretend to explain what these charts are. > Perf…

Remember last time Apple put out these weird relative performance charts, and we all thought they were hiding something?

The M1 announcement. They turned out to be pretty accurate.

So I’ll wait and see real benchmarks, but it wouldn’t surprise me if this does have incredible performance.

Re: Apple M1 Ultra

#465

I think the GPU claims are interesting. According to the graph's footer, the M1 Ultra was compared to an RTX 3090. If the performance/wattage claims are correct, I'm wondering if the Mac Studio could become an "affordable" personal machine learning workstation (which also won't make the electricity bill skyrocket). If Pytorch becomes stable and easy to use on Apple Silicon [0][1], it could be an appealing choice. [0]…

The GPU claims on the M1 Pro & Max were, let's say, cherry picked to put it nicely. The M1 Ultra claims already look suspicious since the GPU graph tops out at ~120W & the CPU graph tops out at ~60W yet the M1 Studio is rated for 370W continuous power draw. Since you mention ML specifically, looking at some benchmarks out there (like https://tlkh.dev/benchmarking-the-apple-m1-max#heading-gpu & https://wandb.ai/tcapel…

I'm confident the marketing oversells it, but it's likely very good in comparison. 3090 is about 28B transistors on Samsung 8nm, with some budgeted for raytracing. This is on TSMC 5nm, a process with 3-4x the density, and the 114B transistor count could potentially allow for similar GPU size - although I'd wait for Locuza or someone to analyze it. It should be very competitive in performance, and the winner by far in perf/watt, at least until RDNA3 and Lovelace GPUs release towards the end of the year.

Re: Apple M1 Ultra

#466

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But it's still impossible to replace RTX 3090 with this new Mac Studio because games just will not run on MacOS.

Maybe Valve can port proton to mac

They used to have a Proton port for Mac, and discontinued it.

Re: Apple M1 Ultra

#467

I think the GPU claims are interesting. According to the graph's footer, the M1 Ultra was compared to an RTX 3090. If the performance/wattage claims are correct, I'm wondering if the Mac Studio could become an "affordable" personal machine learning workstation (which also won't make the electricity bill skyrocket). If Pytorch becomes stable and easy to use on Apple Silicon [0][1], it could be an appealing choice. [0]…

The GPU claims on the M1 Pro & Max were, let's say, cherry picked to put it nicely. The M1 Ultra claims already look suspicious since the GPU graph tops out at ~120W & the CPU graph tops out at ~60W yet the M1 Studio is rated for 370W continuous power draw. Since you mention ML specifically, looking at some benchmarks out there (like https://tlkh.dev/benchmarking-the-apple-m1-max#heading-gpu & https://wandb.ai/tcapel…

> The M1 Ultra claims already look suspicious since the GPU graph tops out at ~120W & the CPU graph tops out at ~60W yet the M1 Studio is rated for 370W continuous power draw.

And that is expected, a lot has to be reserved for USB devices.

Re: Apple M1 Ultra

#468

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Since the context here is using these machines for work, a mid-level engineer will easily cost an extra $1000* in his own time to put that together :) EDIT: I’m quite confident this is not at all an exaggeration. Unless you have put together PCs for a living. $100/h (total employment cost, not just salary), 1-2 hours of actual build & setup, 8 more hours of speccing out parts, buying, taking delivery, installing stuf…

1000 bucks for 45 mins work? Maybe 1.5hrs tops? I didn't realise their wage was >500 an hour?

To be fair here, there is more to it than just assembly.

You have to spec out the parts, ensuring compatibility. Manage multiple orders and deliveries. Assemble it. Install drivers/configuration specific packages.

All of these things are easier today than ten or twenty years ago - but assigning it to a random mid-level engineer and I'd set my project management gamble on half a day for the busiest, most focused engineers least likely to take the time to fuss over specs, or one day for the majority.

ofc. to get to $1000 for that they'd still have to be on $230k to $460k.

Re: Apple M1 Ultra

#469
post #76

At what point Apple will put those chips in their servers or sell server chips? It only makes sense for them to take this architecture to the cloud deployments

They likely won't re-visit the Xserve, IMO. No reason to. They can't sell them at a premium compared to peers and its outside their area of expertise.

To be fair, that exact criticism has been leveled against them multiple times before and been proven wrong.

Re: Apple M1 Ultra

#470

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The only reason I've ever cared about watts is that generally speaking 120 watt and 180 watt processors require more complicated cooling solutions. That's less true today than it ever was. Cases are designed for things like liquid cooling, and they tend to be pretty silent. The processors stay cool, and are pretty reliable. I personally stick to the lower wattage ones because I don't generally need high end stuff, so…

Air coolers can handle 300 watts without any complexity. Just a big block of fins on heat pipes.

I mean, yeah, but then you've got case issues and whatnot. I appreciate your point though.
Post reply on HN