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Lead exposure in last century shrunk IQ scores of half of Americans: study

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Re: Lead exposure in last century shrunk IQ scores of half of Americans: study

#321

Post by deepsquirrelnet »

manuelabeledo wrote: post #97
legitster wrote: post #61

I have a strong worries that our current generation will have a similar huge reckoning with marijuana. We are already seeing studies that show regular marijuana use is correlated with permanent decreases in intelligence, memory loss, motivation, and mental health. And anecdotally, this seems very apparent in my peer group. And Americans are using copious amounts of the stuff right now, and younger than ever before. I…

> I have a strong worries that our current generation will have a similar huge reckoning with marijuana. There might be such a reckoning, just not at the same level or with the same impact. Water is simply a necessity, and marijuana is not. Quite literally 100% of Americans ingest water in some capacity and/or means. Also, brain development delay and interference, caused by contaminated water, would be present in chi…

Cannabis will probably never be legalized for children, outside of some extreme medical conditions -- or CBD, which is not psychoactive. It is clear that THC is not good for a developing brain.

It is also likely that cannabis is generally less harmful than alcohol or even acetaminophen, and unlike those, considered fairly non-toxic. Consider that cannabis metabolites can be detected in your body for up to a month after consumption. It's apparently not that high of a priority for your body to purge it. Cannabis does not need to be combusted. The resins will readily vaporize at temperatures well below the point at which the plant matter actually burns.

I no longer consume alcohol, but occasionally consume cannabis. My personal decision comes from a lot of experience with both, the way my body feels after consuming them, and studied risks associated with each. I exercise responsible moderation in my consumption and strongly believe that cannabis is the safer choice.

This conversation is more about the extent to which we need to protect adults from their own adult decisions, and/or protect the antiquated and partially racist underpinnings behind how and why cannabis was initially made illegal. To that end, I'm not sure it bears much, if any, similarity to lead exposure.

Re: Lead exposure in last century shrunk IQ scores of half of Americans: study

#322

Post by hammock »

breakyerself wrote: post #248

Black children had an adjusted 0.73 to 1.41 µg/dL more blood Pb (p https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7084658/

From the study:

>examined risk factors; survey years; binary gender; bodyweight; low birthweight; anemia; health insurance coverage; Medicaid/CHIP enrollment; federal Women, Infants, and Children (WIC) supplemental food program enrollment; use of water treatment devices; b age in months; c educational attainment less than 9th grade education; d housing built before 1960 or 1940; e number of cigarettes smoked inside the home per day (1 to 40 or more); f poverty-to-income ratios

I don't see traffic proximity aka urbanicity aka leaded gasoline particulate pollution in there.

Lead plumbing and lead paint are two factors. But there is lead all through the soil and air as well.

Re: Lead exposure in last century shrunk IQ scores of half of Americans: study

#323

Post by survirtual »

giobox wrote: post #188
dylan604 wrote: post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It does no harm to a user, to third parties, nor to society, Except it opens doors in people's minds which allows them to think differently for themselves. This results in them behaving less like sheeple. Why would that ever be scary for society?

My experience is it opens the door to not thinking much at all, but your mileage may vary. Is there anything more "sheeple" like than a bunch of stoned people sitting around not motivated to do much? Sure, not all mj users may experience it this way, but a lot do! I certainly wouldn't be arguing it opens the door to a bunch of usefully profound thinkers in society.

MJ on its own has certainly ruined some people, especially daily users. I would argue, however, significantly less so than alcohol. It also has a much lower harm fact on others than alcohol.

MJ used more sparingly, and especially when used on someone with exposure to a psychedelic (not simultaneously but maybe the weekend after a trip)? Entirely different ballgame. It can awaken an internal symphony of inspiration and thinking.

Everything can be abused. Eat too much if anything and you will suffer. But when used appropriately, very magical experiences can be had that enable routes of thinking and problem solving that seem to come from out of this world.

In general, my recommendation to anyone is to try these things while simply meditating or hiking a safe & easy trail. Your mileage will vary but when done correctly, you will acquire otherworldly inspiration applicable towards your skilled professions and hobbies.

And if nothing else, even falling short of that result, this possibility should be enough for legality.

Re: Lead exposure in last century shrunk IQ scores of half of Americans: study

#324

Post by cylon13 »

jart wrote: post #317
redleader55 wrote: post #209

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The IQ should be defined for the human race, in a time independent way, not for a specific nation or group. This allows us to make comparisons between different times, between different societies, etc. Otherwise, if the IQ is redefined to always follow the current mean, it can only be used to classify people between smarter than average and "dumber" than average, which is not so useful.

I guess it's useful if your goal is to figure out how to divide kids into separate math classes. I don't think anyone intended ability to rotate blocks and scramble letters as a timeless gauge of the quality of a person.

Don’t conflate intelligence with quality or value. Every human being is inherently valuable independent of their intelligence, and there are plenty of other interesting features besides intelligence that make people unique and interesting. Believing that IQ measures something tangible is not equivalent to ranking people based on their value any more than believing height or weight measure something real.

Re: Lead exposure in last century shrunk IQ scores of half of Americans: study

#326

Post by eli_gottlieb »

miketery wrote: post #20
softwarebeware wrote: post #10

It makes me angry to think of how wreckless the generations before millenials were. Lead's risks and damages were well-known long before 1996. And they still didn't ban it until then.

Same goes for sugar. We know the dangers it poses, we are also seeing how much it increases risk of death due to covid. I don't think we should be surpsied, as much as pushing to regulate this garbage. As an aside, Michelle Obama's campaign when Obama was in office was about improvement children's health. Her focus was going to be on nutrition (lunch food). Shortly thereafter Coke and Pepsi came in with "donations" a…

>As an aside, Michelle Obama's campaign when Obama was in office was about improvement children's health. Her focus was going to be on nutrition (lunch food). Shortly thereafter Coke and Pepsi came in with "donations" and the whole thing became about exercise, no focus on nutrition.

Well also, the right-wing culture war machine decided Michelle Obama was taking everyone's children's freedoms away.

Re: Lead exposure in last century shrunk IQ scores of half of Americans: study

#327

Post by Krasnol »

ivanech wrote: post #249

The Lead Exposure Elimination Project ( https://leadelimination.org/ ) is an organization that's working to solve this problem internationally. I've been giving money on a monthly basis and have been blown away by their progress.

> Experts suggest that lead paint is now one of the most important current and future sources of lead exposure, as well as the most tractable source to address.

https://leadelimination.org/factfile/

Why is it so popular in the US? Is it better? Cheaper?

I'm quite shocked to see it's still happening. Lead in pain has been forbidden for interiors in Germany since 1921 (exterior since 1989)...

Re: Lead exposure in last century shrunk IQ scores of half of Americans: study

#328

Post by jhoechtl »

micromacrofoot wrote: post #3
amelius wrote: post #2

And what about crime rates?

From what I've read the removal of lead from gasoline is partially a factor in the sudden reduction of crime during the latter half of the 20th century, but it's not enough to explain the entire trend... which seems to be a preponderance of factors.

The remainder can be explained by bread and games = cheap food and game consoles which kept the kids playing in the house instead of being part of a gang.

Re: Lead exposure in last century shrunk IQ scores of half of Americans: study

#329

Post by darawk »

cutemonster wrote: post #285
quercetumMons wrote: post #231

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd imagine that it is nearly impossible to control for time with tests like IQ.

Auto generate IQ tests, so cannot be learned by trying many times / cannot learn by heart. And have people in the next generation do the same auto generated tests. This won't be perfect, but, using mathematics, Id think it would be possible to know how (im)precise the comparisons would be (confidence intervals of the differences). Also, might not work for really bright people (they'd learn how the auto generated test…

This doesn't work because of the Flynn effect. Raw IQ scores have been consistently increasing over time. So much so that the average person in the 1920s would be considered mentally challenged today, if you used their raw IQ scores. However, we know that obviously the average person in the 1920s was not mentally challenged in the sense that someone with that same raw score would be today.

This is all a pretty big mystery and suggests we really don't understand this "IQ" thing we are measuring. However, one big consequence is that we definitely cannot meaningfully compare scores across time.

Re: Lead exposure in last century shrunk IQ scores of half of Americans: study

#330

Post by istjohn »

Krasnol wrote: post #327
ivanech wrote: post #249

The Lead Exposure Elimination Project ( https://leadelimination.org/ ) is an organization that's working to solve this problem internationally. I've been giving money on a monthly basis and have been blown away by their progress.

> Experts suggest that lead paint is now one of the most important current and future sources of lead exposure, as well as the most tractable source to address. https://leadelimination.org/factfile/ Why is it so popular in the US? Is it better? Cheaper? I'm quite shocked to see it's still happening. Lead in pain has been forbidden for interiors in Germany since 1921 (exterior since 1989)...

It was banned in the US in 1978.
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