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Venting doesn’t work
71–80 of 193 posts
Re: Venting doesn’t work
#72Earlier quoted context omitted.
When I bang my thumb with a hammer I yell FUUUUUCCCCKKKKKK as loud as I can, are you telling me that doesn't make the pain less? I'm almost 100% certain that form of catharsis works. It even works in reverse for me, if I'm having a moment of intense emotional strain, punching the wall (also yelling fuck as loud as possible) resets my brain. To say catharsis doesn't work seems to be a limitation of the definition of c…
That's mischaracterization of catharsis. As for releasing intense emotional strain - you're more likely to lash out. Have you tried not punching the wall and have a time out instead? Because people who "punch the wall" are, according to multiple studies, more likely to lash out and be abusive.
> Because people who "punch the wall" are, according to multiple studies, more likely to lash out and be abusive.
Presumably the wall-punching and tendency toward other physical/emotional abuses are tied to one or more underlying common causes.
That is, people shouldn't be told to punch a wall (for cartharsis) or even necessarily not to do so (because it'll make you abusive), but those for whom that is a temptation or tendency should seek assistance to uncover and address the root causes.
Re: Venting doesn’t work
#73> As one researcher put it, “Venting anger is like using gasoline to put out a fire.”
The analogy holds only if the problem is one that is in some way exacerbated (i.e. fueled by) anger (even if only by growing worse due to appropriate action not being taken due to focus on anger).
If anger is not relevant to the problem, then no. For instance, if you're angry that 2 + 2 isn't 5, venting will not make that issue escalate; 2 + 2 will not get farther away from 5 just to spite you for venting.
Re: Venting doesn’t work
#74If true, wouldn’t this undermine the entire psychiatric approach of behavioral cognitive therapy and ideas such as confronting one’s fears and talking through problems?
If the headline is true, yes. If the article is true, the opposite.
Re: Venting doesn’t work
#75Stop using small sample sized studies done on college campuses (n = 600, 178, 60) to push clickbait headline articles. Sounds like saying, "Don't cry when you're sad it Doesn't Work" How about let people do what they want? People vent because they want to know they aren't crazy or at fault. Not because they're trying to be calm or forget grievances.
On studies with students:
Our prefrontal cortex [which plays critical role in cognition, emotional regulation, and control of impulsive behavior] doesn't come fully online until you are about 24 (!). Given that, I take all studies done on university campuses with students younger than 24 with a good spoonful of salt.
Re: Venting doesn’t work
#76Earlier quoted context omitted.
I can link you to another bunch. Because I took interest on the subject. I've been told to "vent" almost all of my life and only a few years ago I got exposed to this research. I'm citing one of the earlier ones and there's plenty of newer studies. My "allegations" are based in research and not empty words(unlike the accusations in your comment)
It's pretty incredible how few comments in this thread are saying "huh, this is interesting, I should try this, research backs it up." That's the engineer or HN way, isn't it? (Not being sarcastic, I include myself in this). When data comes along which disproves or at least weakens a previously held position, adjust your priors and try it out. Note: you can say "not until it's proven" but I can cite plenty of less we…
Exactly.
Right now all data that I can find tells me to not vent, but take a time out. You know.... how we have "count to 10 before saying anything nasty".
Re: Venting doesn’t work
#77Unpopular opinion, I expect, but until, and unless, there is a reckoning with the replication crisis in psychology, Hacker News should treat this kind of article the same way they would treat one which takes homeopathy seriously.
I've flagged it as irrelevant and suggest you do so also.
Re: Venting doesn’t work
#78From Robert Sapolsky's Behave , I learnt about the notion of "displacement aggression". We know what it is intuitively, but in short: depressingly enough, the reason stress encourages aggression is that it reduces stress. And we don't yet know the underlying biology of it. - - - Excuse the wall of text, but it's entirely worth reading Sapolsky's description of this: [quote] Shock a rat and its glucocorticoid levels […
A couple people have mentioned Sapolsky and he came to my mind also. Here's a comment I made a while back along the same lines on an article about why swearing (as a form of venting) does work (https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12229422). Sapolsky again on rats and baboons (from Why Zebra’s Don’t Get Ulcers):
A variant of Weiss's experiment uncovers a special feature of the outlet-for-frustration reaction. This time, when the rat gets the identical series of electric shocks and is upset, it can run across the cage, sit next to another rat and... bite the hell out of it. Stress-induced displacement of aggression: the practice works wonders at minimizing the stressfulness of a stressor. It's a real primate specialty as well. A male baboon loses a fight. Frustrated, he spins around and attacks a subordinate male who was minding his own business. An extremely high percentage of primate aggression represent frustration displaced onto innocent bystanders.
I recently left a job and boss where this dynamic was very much in play (more blaming than biting but obvious displacement aggression all the same).
My conclusion: swearing (venting) might be seen as a more civilized form of displacing stress-induced aggression.
Re: Venting doesn’t work
#79Earlier quoted context omitted.
Do you know of a single study that supports catharsis? Because all studies I know of disprove or end up inconclusive.
It seems plausible that catharsis makes some people more agitated and perhaps unhappy. It also seems likely that those agitated, unhappy people continue to struggle and don't give up as opposed to those who "stop venting". "Do not go gentle into that good night. Rage, rage against the dying of the light." — Dylan Thomas
Don't give up, or train themselves to be agitated and unhappy?
Re: Venting doesn’t work
#80Can't help but think the term "toxic," discredits the whole thing as a vehicle for something else. Aggression is natural and universal, but the tools for expressing and self-regulating it are not. One description of it that resonated personally for me was Robert Sapolsky's "depression is aggression turned inward," and while the phrase doesn't do the whole idea justice, it's more useful than hollow and seductive clich…
Maybe this is wrong, but it sounds like you were in toxic relationships, ones which you were able to escape by asserting your boundaries. Asserting yourself is a little different than being hostile and/or violent, which is what aggression is usually considered.
In any case and semantics aside, congrats on removing relationships that were pushing you inwards and making you unhappy. Like the article mentions, brain pathways and behavior are like hiking paths, it's incredibly difficult to forge new ones and continually use them until it's normal.