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Venting doesn’t work

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61–70 of 193 posts

Re: Venting doesn’t work

#61

I think they've missed the point. Venting isn't for catharsis; It's for seeking validation. When you vent TO someone and they lend a sympathetic ear, it's a huge help. Venting is a social bonding ritual. You generally don't get this online because most of the audience is NOT sympathetic, so you'll get criticism after criticism, making things even worse.

Yes it's a communicative act. Communication can be bounced off others for social validation as you say, but can also be to oneself.

You'd still vent, if alone on a desert island, maybe to The Gods.

Ever hear yourself saying out loud, usually with expletives, something that you would "never say"? Listen to that voice!

That's communication of unconscious but frustrated thoughts. Sometimes it has to come out verbally because ones inner dialogue isn't strong enough due to social or superego suppression.

After you said it to yourself you feel better.

We are not the singular identities simpler minds suppose us.

Re: Venting doesn’t work

#62
post #9

It sounds like the aggressive behavior was measured pretty soon after hitting the punching bag. It would be interesting to run the test again after the adrenaline has worn off. I don't think proponents of catharsis are claiming that screaming at a tree if going to instantly make you calmer, it's that later that day you might feel better. Also, participants were instructed to focus their anger on the perpetrator of th…

Do you know of a single study that supports catharsis? Because all studies I know of disprove or end up inconclusive.

It seems plausible that catharsis makes some people more agitated and perhaps unhappy.

It also seems likely that those agitated, unhappy people continue to struggle and don't give up as opposed to those who "stop venting".

"Do not go gentle into that good night. Rage, rage against the dying of the light." — Dylan Thomas

Re: Venting doesn’t work

#63
Doing good science around this kind of stuff is extremely difficult ...

My personal experience with Psychodrama and Gestalt in the late '70s and early '80s was that for someone like myself who was very much 'in my head', it was an opportunity to acknowledge my own repressed anger. But in retrospect, it was/is also behavior rehearsal for bad behavior in the rest of my life. More effective was modern Somatic Experience techniques where the impulse to respond in anger is explored with a lot of inner attention and slow-motion movements of pushing away and/or striking back. I would call it more grounded and more present. There is dissociation that occurred for me with so-called cathartic anger.

The variation in 'venting' adds to the complexity of the conversation. Physical venting vs naming sources of anger/frustration. Based on my personal experience, physical venting is far less effective than verbal venting, and of course verbal venting is massively variable. Naming the exact source of frustration strikes me as more likely to be usefully defusing than just shouting that someone is an f-ing a*hole. I can imagine the inclusion of humor, for example, would have a huge impact.

Re: Venting doesn’t work

#64
post #41

One of the most stressful projects I ever worked on had a really great way of dealing with the stress (a policy that I created). Every meeting, at the beginning of the meeting, everybody was required to complain for 5 minutes. Just talk about all the stupid decisions that got us to this point, how unreasonable the timeline was, any staffing issues you were having, any parts you needed, etc. 5 minutes. You are require…

How did you make sure that no one would complain that "Bob was an idiot who kept breaking the build", or "Alice never does her code reviews and blocks everyone"?

Re: Venting doesn’t work

#65

Can't help but think the term "toxic," discredits the whole thing as a vehicle for something else. Aggression is natural and universal, but the tools for expressing and self-regulating it are not. One description of it that resonated personally for me was Robert Sapolsky's "depression is aggression turned inward," and while the phrase doesn't do the whole idea justice, it's more useful than hollow and seductive clich…

Did you apply this concept from a book or other set of writings? I’m just curious about this process and would like to learn more.

Re: Venting doesn’t work

#66
This seems like a great case of a bad headline derailing discussion. The first study quoted uses hitting a punching bag as an example of venting. I’d contrast that against what I think of as venting: talking about what’s bothering you without looking for the discussion to solve anything other than providing space to say what you’re feeling. When they say venting doesn’t work, they’re referring to a specific kind of venting.

> In more general terms, embracing our feelings isn’t the same as expressing them, and not all forms of expression are created equal. Realizing “I’m angry” (always OK) is a different beast from telling someone “I’m angry” (sometimes OK), and it’s even further from berating a loved one for causing your anger (not OK).

It’s a good article with a nuanced point, and all the discussion reacting to the shitty headline is a shame.

Re: Venting doesn’t work

#67
post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you know of a single study that supports catharsis? Because all studies I know of disprove or end up inconclusive.

Anecdata but a good boxing session after a stressful workday always makes me feel better. High intensity running also works. Great for relieving various undirected frustrations. Especially of the angry kind. Writing in a journal does wonders for the more subtle things. When your mind is running in circles trying to process something. The act of writing it out helps me avoid circles and get to a conclusion. The only t…

It definitely seems likely that physical activity is beneficial. I'd be curious to see studies comparing something like running vs. boxing. (Also weightlifting vs. cardio, or springs vs. long-distance.)

Additionally, one thing that's often obscured in studies (or the reporting thereof) is that different people are different. Studies say that running doesn't help people lose weight, but that's looking for significant effects across a population. For some individuals, it does. The concept of "ymmv" is incredibly important when you care about individual impacts.

Re: Venting doesn’t work

#68
I've found the problem with venting can be that it cements an idea in your head.

This is particularly true with people. If I find myself venting that doesn't know what the heck they're doing, I've internally solidified that belief. If improves, if I'm on another project with where they clearly have a lot of knowledge, then it can still be too late. I've verbalized to myself ( and worse, my partner ) that X is incompetent and I'm not going to easily let that go.

I think it's true with other things. is a terrible idea, 's code base is a mess. If I let it role over me, notice things without forcing an opinion, I'm more likely to realize I've judged to soon.

Re: Venting doesn’t work

#69
post #41

One of the most stressful projects I ever worked on had a really great way of dealing with the stress (a policy that I created). Every meeting, at the beginning of the meeting, everybody was required to complain for 5 minutes. Just talk about all the stupid decisions that got us to this point, how unreasonable the timeline was, any staffing issues you were having, any parts you needed, etc. 5 minutes. You are require…

There's a subtle distinction that I don't think the article addressed very well.

One thing is doing something like: I know I am angry at you, my reasons are very clear to me, and now, without adding to my understanding of them, I am going to yell at you for 15 minutes, loudly.

Another is doing this: not really being sure what you're anxious or angry about, so talking about it to explore your muddled thoughts and figure it out, in a regular to soft voice.

I can see how they flow into each other and too much of the second inevitably becomes the first. But when capped (like at 5 minutes) - appropriately modulated (not yelling anger) - in a group context (further modulating the emotions) - you could arguably get the benefits of the 2nd without the downsides of the 1st.

Re: Venting doesn’t work

#70
post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you know of a single study that supports catharsis? Because all studies I know of disprove or end up inconclusive.

Anecdata but a good boxing session after a stressful workday always makes me feel better. High intensity running also works. Great for relieving various undirected frustrations. Especially of the angry kind. Writing in a journal does wonders for the more subtle things. When your mind is running in circles trying to process something. The act of writing it out helps me avoid circles and get to a conclusion. The only t…

Intense physical activity isn't necessarily violent catharsis.

I almost never engage in catharsis now, but I do go on half marathon runs when I'm stressed. They're not the same thing... as like yelling at my husband over random annoyances.

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