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Steve Wozniak: Steve Jobs wasn’t a natural-born leader

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Re: Steve Wozniak: Steve Jobs wasn’t a natural-born leader

#31

Post by duxup »

blue_box wrote: post #4

> “Sometimes motivation, wanting something, is a lot more important than having the real skill,” Wozniak said.

I think technically inclined folks are so inclined to think about skills they miss that aspect sometimes (including me).

A local football coach was giving a talk and said "a lot of people want things, but very few people are willing to do what it takes".

The message was that the opportunities are out there, and it might be surprising how few people are reaching for it / doing what it takes to get it so quit worrying about imaginary "better" folks who likely aren't even trying.

The older I get the more I realize that's true.

Re: Steve Wozniak: Steve Jobs wasn’t a natural-born leader

#32

Post by kobalsky »

JKCalhoun wrote: post #16
zcw100 wrote: post #2

What really set Steve Jobs apart is that he never should have gotten to where he did. I don't mean he didn't deserve it or anything but based on that structures that exist to filter people who attain the positions that he did. By luck, or accident, or raw determination, he became a person in the drivers seat that no one would have chose to put there. He was so much not the person they would have chosen that they kick…

I think I disagree. I think Jobs personality was such that he would have either ended up founding a company (or perhaps ended up in prison for selling narcotics). I sense his manipulative personality (my words, for other's you can substitute "reality distortion field") was always there. I'm not disputing Wozniak of course, but I think Jobs growth was in learning how to channel that personality toward selling product.…

> Jobs got to where he was because he had a smart friend

You can dislike the man, but saying that is not fair, he was far from a one hit wonder.

Apple, NeXT, Pixar? those are the ones I recall. Luck won't get you there.

Re: Steve Wozniak: Steve Jobs wasn’t a natural-born leader

#33

Post by mrtksn »

zcw100 wrote: post #2

What really set Steve Jobs apart is that he never should have gotten to where he did. I don't mean he didn't deserve it or anything but based on that structures that exist to filter people who attain the positions that he did. By luck, or accident, or raw determination, he became a person in the drivers seat that no one would have chose to put there. He was so much not the person they would have chosen that they kick…

I disagree, Steve Jobs didn't luck out. Instead, he never went through the filters.

Had he tried to become an Aircraft Engineer or a Doctor, he might get filtered out but he and Woz ventured into an unestablished field that was about to boom. There were no filters to keep him out and though he lacked a scholar formation he was exceptionally brilliant and managed to walk the path better than the most.

Peter Thiel says "competition is for losers". I think Steve Jobs is an example of it. Even if Steve Jobs said he was competing, Apple rarely competed and won on equal terms under Steve Jobs. He had always maintained a startup mentality, instead of making better phone than Nokia he would make something that no one at Nokia or anywhere else even dreamed of. IMHO, his leadership style was exactly what it takes to drive bunch of brilliant people into the jungle where the great riches are hidden but he was no match to Tim Cook as a CEO.

To this day, When I listen to his old interviews etc. I'm hypnotised by the clearness and the flow of his mind. It's probably because he was one of those who made what we have today but if you forget that for a moment he sounds like a time traveler from the 2000s explaining the value of computers to regular folks from the 70s.

What an extraordinary man.

Re: Steve Wozniak: Steve Jobs wasn’t a natural-born leader

#34

Post by svantana »

hnthrowaway0315 wrote: post #5
blue_box wrote: post #4

> “Sometimes motivation, wanting something, is a lot more important than having the real skill,” Wozniak said.

Long term motivation is a very, very rare characteristics. I'd say it is almost born or influenced by childhood experience, not grown.

Artist Jenny Holzer wrote in 1999: "Monomania is a prerequisite of success", that quote has stuck with me. Most people (myself included) get distracted and change focus easily, which I think is healthy, but being long-term obsessed probably helps your chances of being really successful in late capitalism.

Re: Steve Wozniak: Steve Jobs wasn’t a natural-born leader

#35

Post by pavlov »

mrtksn wrote: post #33
zcw100 wrote: post #2

What really set Steve Jobs apart is that he never should have gotten to where he did. I don't mean he didn't deserve it or anything but based on that structures that exist to filter people who attain the positions that he did. By luck, or accident, or raw determination, he became a person in the drivers seat that no one would have chose to put there. He was so much not the person they would have chosen that they kick…

I disagree, Steve Jobs didn't luck out. Instead, he never went through the filters. Had he tried to become an Aircraft Engineer or a Doctor, he might get filtered out but he and Woz ventured into an unestablished field that was about to boom. There were no filters to keep him out and though he lacked a scholar formation he was exceptionally brilliant and managed to walk the path better than the most. Peter Thiel says…

I don’t agree with Thiel on a lot of things, but in this instance I do.

When someone says “I’m very competitive,” I hear that they want to live inside boxes created by other people.

Re: Steve Wozniak: Steve Jobs wasn’t a natural-born leader

#37

Post by stocknoob »

yyyppp wrote: post #24
JKCalhoun wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think I disagree. I think Jobs personality was such that he would have either ended up founding a company (or perhaps ended up in prison for selling narcotics). I sense his manipulative personality (my words, for other's you can substitute "reality distortion field") was always there. I'm not disputing Wozniak of course, but I think Jobs growth was in learning how to channel that personality toward selling product.…

That's such a disgruntled take. Having a "smart friend" was merely a nice advantage. Jobs' strength was in how he saw the world. His intuition, ability to imagine the future, inspire others and execute on that vision. Marketing and communications skills then almost felt like a by-product of such rare personality traits. I suggest reading "Jony Ive: The Genius Behind Apple's Greatest Products" or any interviews with J…

It makes me chuckle when people dismiss the industry-defining success of Apple as just marketing.

Gee, why don’t their competitors try that?

Re: Steve Wozniak: Steve Jobs wasn’t a natural-born leader

#38

Post by dragonwriter »

stocknoob wrote: post #37
yyyppp wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's such a disgruntled take. Having a "smart friend" was merely a nice advantage. Jobs' strength was in how he saw the world. His intuition, ability to imagine the future, inspire others and execute on that vision. Marketing and communications skills then almost felt like a by-product of such rare personality traits. I suggest reading "Jony Ive: The Genius Behind Apple's Greatest Products" or any interviews with J…

It makes me chuckle when people dismiss the industry-defining success of Apple as just marketing. Gee, why don’t their competitors try that?

It makes me chuckle when people dismiss the industry-defining success of Apple marketing.

Re: Steve Wozniak: Steve Jobs wasn’t a natural-born leader

#40

Post by stocknoob »

pavlov wrote: post #35
mrtksn wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I disagree, Steve Jobs didn't luck out. Instead, he never went through the filters. Had he tried to become an Aircraft Engineer or a Doctor, he might get filtered out but he and Woz ventured into an unestablished field that was about to boom. There were no filters to keep him out and though he lacked a scholar formation he was exceptionally brilliant and managed to walk the path better than the most. Peter Thiel says…

I don’t agree with Thiel on a lot of things, but in this instance I do. When someone says “I’m very competitive,” I hear that they want to live inside boxes created by other people.

Thanks, I couldn’t quite put my finger on it, but something about the competitive mindset rubbed me the wrong way. It’s all about seeking external validation in the existing status quo.
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