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Amazon in talks with HP to buy Palm

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Re: Amazon in talks with HP to buy Palm

#81

Post by cpeterso »

Charmander wrote: post #68
j_col wrote: post #15

As a long-suffering webOS fan (Pre- through to Pre3 & Touchpad), all I have to say to this news is, yay! WebOS is a fantastic system that does not deserve to linger and die due to HP's lack of leadership and vision. Jeff Bezzos, on the other hand, is a true visionary in my opinion and I would be happy to see my webOS HP Profile become an Amazon profile sometime soon. My only doubt though: will they make phones?

Amazon will make iPod Touch like devices before they make phones (although the Kindle Fire already falls into that market segment due its price point). This proposed webOS purchase is to hedge their bets against Google keeping ICS and future versions closed source. Amazon can't out a 10" Kindle tablet with the underlying system based on Gingerbread. The Amazon services could be provided but there would be no apps and…

> Amazon can't out a 10" Kindle tablet with the underlying system based on Gingerbread.

Why not? What makes Gingerbread so inappropriate for a tablet compared to Honeycomb or Ice Cream Sandwich? Amazon can tabletize Gingerbread in their fork.

Re: Amazon in talks with HP to buy Palm

#82

Post by jonursenbach »

w33ble wrote: post #80
rudiger wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How is the Kindle Fire not a tablet?

It kind of is as a secondary function, but it was built as a media consumption/purchasing device, a kind of hand-held portal into the world of Amazon; even their browser relies heavily on their EC2 platform. Compared to the Android tablets on the market, it lacks a lot in the way of expandability and even storage. Even the underlying Android OS was forked to bring it further away from a tablet and more to an Amazon p…

Aren't all tablets media consumption and purchasing devices though?

Re: Amazon in talks with HP to buy Palm

#83

Post by RexRollman »

technoslut wrote: post #67
zitterbewegung wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think they will make phones or even continue webOS. I have a feeling that this is a talent acquisition and they will use it to improve the Kindle Fire.

They will undoubtedly make phones. Why give away a market to competitors that is worth billions? Amazon wants to keep users in their ecosystem. To do that you need a phone as well, which they're essentially already doing in their AppStore. Within three years Amazon will come out with their own phone. It will be the same game plan that they used with the Fire and gear it towards the low end. Eventually they will go to…

"They will undoubtedly make phones."

I don't see anything undoubtedly about it. The celluar phone market is a quagmire.

Re: Amazon in talks with HP to buy Palm

#84

Post by RexRollman »

nodata wrote: post #43
octover wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, they didn't. The biggest sign you can see out in the open is that the Fire is running a fork of 2.3 Gingerbread instead of 3.0 Honeycomb or the upcoming Ice Cream Sandwich.

Oh yes, from looking at them essentially forking it, it looks like they didn't work together. But my question was whether or not they _did_ work together, one of the tech sites wrote that they did. I will try and find the reference.

I seem to remember that as well but I have no reference for it.

Re: Amazon in talks with HP to buy Palm

#85

Post by barista »

cpeterso wrote: post #81
Charmander wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Amazon will make iPod Touch like devices before they make phones (although the Kindle Fire already falls into that market segment due its price point). This proposed webOS purchase is to hedge their bets against Google keeping ICS and future versions closed source. Amazon can't out a 10" Kindle tablet with the underlying system based on Gingerbread. The Amazon services could be provided but there would be no apps and…

> Amazon can't out a 10" Kindle tablet with the underlying system based on Gingerbread. Why not? What makes Gingerbread so inappropriate for a tablet compared to Honeycomb or Ice Cream Sandwich? Amazon can tabletize Gingerbread in their fork.

Exactly. I don't get why Amazon would buy a new OS when it can get an existing well supported well publicized and we ll maintained OS for free. Currently they are freeloading on android which is a great thing to get all the android benefits without having to pay apenny for it. Why spend money on a new platform and then spend some more developing for it and inviting developers to it. I hope they don't make this mistake.

Re: Amazon in talks with HP to buy Palm

#86

Post by barista »

untog wrote: post #77
technoslut wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They will undoubtedly make phones. Why give away a market to competitors that is worth billions? Amazon wants to keep users in their ecosystem. To do that you need a phone as well, which they're essentially already doing in their AppStore. Within three years Amazon will come out with their own phone. It will be the same game plan that they used with the Fire and gear it towards the low end. Eventually they will go to…

"They will undoubtedly make phones. Why give away a market to competitors that is worth billions?" It's an extremely competitive, painful market. MS are struggling, Palm have already tried once and failed. Amazon is taking another approach (having their own AppStore on Android) and it's working out for them. Hardware was Palm and WebOS's weak spot. An Amazon acquisition could be many things, but I very much doubt it'…

Unless they think that their freeloading of android is limiting them in some ways. Currently it seems like a good deal for amazon to get android for free. Don't know what they will gain by buying a new platform.

Re: Amazon in talks with HP to buy Palm

#87

Post by untog »

barista wrote: post #86
untog wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"They will undoubtedly make phones. Why give away a market to competitors that is worth billions?" It's an extremely competitive, painful market. MS are struggling, Palm have already tried once and failed. Amazon is taking another approach (having their own AppStore on Android) and it's working out for them. Hardware was Palm and WebOS's weak spot. An Amazon acquisition could be many things, but I very much doubt it'…

Unless they think that their freeloading of android is limiting them in some ways. Currently it seems like a good deal for amazon to get android for free. Don't know what they will gain by buying a new platform.

Well, Google are secretive about it. Amazon built their OS on top of an old version of Android because Google haven't released the source for their latest efforts yet.

Certainly, if they consider themselves competitors to Android Tablets, it would make sense to get the OS under their control, while perhaps ensuring a certain level of compatibility for app porting, etc.

Re: Amazon in talks with HP to buy Palm

#88

Post by Steko »

barista wrote: post #85
cpeterso wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Amazon can't out a 10" Kindle tablet with the underlying system based on Gingerbread. Why not? What makes Gingerbread so inappropriate for a tablet compared to Honeycomb or Ice Cream Sandwich? Amazon can tabletize Gingerbread in their fork.

Exactly. I don't get why Amazon would buy a new OS when it can get an existing well supported well publicized and we ll maintained OS for free. Currently they are freeloading on android which is a great thing to get all the android benefits without having to pay apenny for it. Why spend money on a new platform and then spend some more developing for it and inviting developers to it. I hope they don't make this mistak…

(1) Android is not free, ask Samsung about the $180 million check they're writing to Microsoft this year and the 20 court cases the have with Apple. There's potential liability with Oracle and if they put 3G/4G chips in them, Nokia. Then since Amazon is forking it they have their own development costs anyway.

(2) Amazon is locked out of Google Services and the latest version of Android, if ICS or Jellybean has a truly killer feature/service they could get their clock cleaned by other Android vendors. Hoping Google will always release the source early on releases yeah you might not want your eggs in that basket.

(3) Integrated development ala Apple can be the most profitable model. (or it can not, cough Palm)

(4) There's a lot of IP here and Amazon doesn't have a lot of patents.

(5) The tanking of everything WebOS may mean the price is very cheap. Maybe they implement a WebOS-like layer in Android.

Re: Amazon in talks with HP to buy Palm

#89

Post by avree »

notatoad wrote: post #75
joelhaasnoot wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So where are there 5 different Kindle products?

there are two different kindle products - the e-ink kindle and the kindle fire. the e-ink kindle has a few different revisions with different input and connectivity methods, but in the end it is all the same functionality: the ability to read books, shop in the kindle store, and nothing else.

I got this e-mail from Amazon today: http://cl.ly/1O1F2Y1X3n2A3W260r2s

It looks like there are quite a few Kindles, and Amazon isn't afraid to differentiate.

Re: Amazon in talks with HP to buy Palm

#90

Post by w33ble »

jonursenbach wrote: post #82
w33ble wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It kind of is as a secondary function, but it was built as a media consumption/purchasing device, a kind of hand-held portal into the world of Amazon; even their browser relies heavily on their EC2 platform. Compared to the Android tablets on the market, it lacks a lot in the way of expandability and even storage. Even the underlying Android OS was forked to bring it further away from a tablet and more to an Amazon p…

Aren't all tablets media consumption and purchasing devices though?

Sure, but none of the Android tablets are really purpose built for that. Samsung, Motorola, Asus and all the others seem to aim to be a kind of more-portable laptop, giving you memory card slots, cameras and to some extent even office type applications. These are the kinds of things that people market as a "tablet" and media consumption is something of an afterthought. The Kindle Fire is the other way around; media consumption is forefront, everything else, including apps to an extent, are an afterthought. This is more along Apple's vision with their iPad, and it's working out pretty well for them too.

At the end of the day, maybe I'm just arguing semantics, but the fact remains that this isn't a "tablet" in the same light as other Android "tablets." It's a bit of a subtle difference, and I think it's that difference that is crucial and will spell massive success for the Fire. Their ability to sell it at what I assume is a sizable loss isn't hurting their chances either.

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