Earlier quoted context omitted.
Except you get 3-15 years in jail for protesting in Russia.
There are only so many jails, temporary detention facilities, and judges to give the verdicts.
Tell that to Stalin
Russians are trying to flee – data from Google Trends
551–560 of 933 posts
Re: Russians are trying to flee – data from Google Trends
#552Earlier quoted context omitted.
>Fleeing the country is a strong peaceful revolt on the other hand No, it just ensures that the only people left in Russia are the ones who support Putin. And like I said, Ukrainians have no choice. Why should Russians? As another poster said, even autocracies need a certain level of support to operate. It's not fair to punish Russians but their country is literally waging a full scale war while threatening the west…
Right, if you were in power people fleeing over the berlin wall would have been shot from both sides, not just by the soviets. Cause they should have stayed inside and overthrown the soviet government. Same goes for north koreans, shoot them and send them back, let them fight the government.
^ the above is a nice example of a strawman[1]. Obviously putting sanctions on citizens of an invading country is very far from shooting them, and yet asats decided to portray his debater as a leader who would murder other people, because perhaps it's too exhausting for him to have an actual, substantive conversation.
Re: Russians are trying to flee – data from Google Trends
#553Earlier quoted context omitted.
Most sanctions have inverse effect of strengthening the authoritharian government. Maybe if you have free press and strong oposition you can use sanctions to turn population against governemnt. However, my experience of suffering under combination of sanctions and authorian government is that dictatorship gets stronger in these cases. I would even support sanctions in the 90-ties against Serbia if they increased our…
A weak, underfed population whose military cannot keep its vehicles in working order isn’t going to be invading its neighbors with any degree of success.
That sounds humanitarian...
Re: Russians are trying to flee – data from Google Trends
#554I managed to escape the country yesterday, had to flight to Egypt of all places, because ALL (even business) tickets were sold out. The recent news is that starting March 6 all international flights are suspended, the trap has closed. The disheartening thing is that even if you never supported Putin, other countries treat you as enemy. I am at Georgia now and banks refuse to open bank accounts to Russians, and I need…
[Disclaimer: Russian] According to my estimations, probably at least 95% of people who are "against the war" do not go out to participate in protests. My estimations are based on talking to my colleagues (large IT company). Yes, starting from now, protesting becomes more risky (you may go to jail for years if you get caught second time). But just a week ago, it was mostly harmless (yes, some people get arrested for f…
American here, and I am involved with the US anti-war movement. I really wish we could get 5% involved with the movement, but people don't get interested unless it starts affecting them or their family. To this day, the most active members of the US anti-war movement are baby boomers because they were being drafted to fight in Vietnam. The US ended the draft after Vietnam.
The sanctions in Russia could build resistance to the war in Russia, but they could also backfire if the Western governments do not set reasonable criteria for removing the sanctions. So far they have not indicated how to end sanctions.
If Western governments will only remove sanctions if Putin is thrown out, than I fear that there is little chance the war will end soon. The Syrian sanctions will never end without regime change so the sanctions are purely punitive.
Re: Russians are trying to flee – data from Google Trends
#555Earlier quoted context omitted.
To make it fair why not have them renounce citizenship and publicly disavow Putin or something? State their full name, former address, etc. Just to make sure they don’t support Putin and never have.
North Korea imprisons friends and family of their defectors, btw.
Yep. And to take this further this would be like someone strongly supporting the North Korean regime and then when they faced the consequences of their actions just skipped down to South Korea and lived happily ever after while millions have suffered for the regime you actively supported. Sorry no sympathy.
Re: Russians are trying to flee – data from Google Trends
#556I escaped from Russia on 25th of February. We bought tickets immediately after bombings started. Since I been in Rostov on Don our airport was closed so we have to take train and then flight to Istanbul. Some of my close friends already joined me here and some strongly consider taking same route as well. Though it's could be too late for them...
I never supported Putin and did what I could to support our opposition leaders - both Navalny and Maxim Katz. I suported them financially, but yeah I did not participate in protests on streets and I certainly wond not do it if there was a risk to spend next 15 years in prison.
PS: I have to look for a job that offer some kind of relocation since my current game development project only lasts till August and I'm not sure what to do next. I have 10+ years of experience with a bit of everything, but recently mostly frontend with TypeScript / Angular / Vue and backend with Java / Spring Boot or PHP / Laravel.
Re: Russians are trying to flee – data from Google Trends
#557No one thinks that a regular Ivan from some russian city (on his own) is responsible for the war and should suffer. And I see how you could (and probably should, at some level) feel sorry for russians fleeing the country. But this is the only way to tell them that they -- collective Ivans, Russian society as a whole -- should stand up and act: they should articulate their content, they should protest against putin's…
Acting in Russia puts you in a very dangerous situation. Already protestors are being jailed, but I wouldn’t be surprised if the military starts firing at or bombing or gassing protestors. Someone who starts war like this doesn’t respect civilian life, Ukrainian or Russian. Would you, personally, put your life at risk just to be one more protestor? I agree that Russians should stand up to Putin, but honestly it’s a l…
> Would you, personally, put your life at risk just to be one more protestor?
I could share you a video of unarmed Ukrainians protesting against russian invasion today in Kherson in front of russian tanks.
If I felt I was responsible for the country I live in, for the president I elected (and who decided to invade another country without any reason), I would put my life at 'risk' (realistically, would be fined or detained for a few days, not killed or jailed). And besides, the more people participate, the less risks are involved. So really it's up to them.
> honestly it’s a lot easier and likely more effective to do this outside of Russia
but you all see the enormous and unprecedented support that the whole world give to Ukraine, you see all of these gathering in every major city of every major Western country -- and yet it doesn't effect putin sadly. So easier - yes, but more effective - I doubt it...
Re: Russians are trying to flee – data from Google Trends
#558Earlier quoted context omitted.
Except you get 3-15 years in jail for protesting in Russia.
Go watch how people go with bare hands to protest russian forces literally this minute. And yes, they don't risk 3-15 years of jail. They have hundreds of times higher chance to die. But they don't use it as an excuse.
There is a very small number of protesters. We'd need a million people to rise up in Moscow alone to make a difference. Putin has too much support among his voters atm. And the iron curtain only solidifies his propaganda machine.
Re: Russians are trying to flee – data from Google Trends
#559I managed to escape the country yesterday, had to flight to Egypt of all places, because ALL (even business) tickets were sold out. The recent news is that starting March 6 all international flights are suspended, the trap has closed. The disheartening thing is that even if you never supported Putin, other countries treat you as enemy. I am at Georgia now and banks refuse to open bank accounts to Russians, and I need…
Honest advice: Get a tshirt with "FUCK PUTIN" printed on it. Wear it everywhere, even if it's covered up by a jacket. If you find yourself in a risky situation, make sure it's showing.
Then they risk getting shot or stabbed by a pro Putin thug or agent. Your advice is patently bad.
Re: Russians are trying to flee – data from Google Trends
#560Earlier quoted context omitted.
According to polls, even run by West outlets, Russians do support Putin in big numbers.
If you don’t trust the official election polls in Russia, why would you trust their opinion polls to be honest. If I were Putin, I would certainly be tempted to manipulate opinion polls to make it look like I am more popular than I really am. As for western media, while no doubt less manipulated than Russian media, I don’t think it is safe to assume that western media is above manipulating public opinion to suit thei…
There are lots of polls done by non-gov-aligned news agencies or even paid by foreign outlets. All of them paint the same picture.
Even here in Lithuania we got quite a few people eating up Russian propaganda and supporting Putin. I’ve no doubts it works even better in Russia.
Any media is biased. That’s how humans operate. The key is to watch different sources. And don’t get into „both sides have some truth“ BS. No, sometimes one side is flat out lying. But IMO it’s important to understand the other side narrative to understand their logic.
Here in Lithuania we got non-stop coverage of Ukraine since 2014. But I’m sure we get no coverage on stuff that is far away and public doesn’t care much.