Russians are trying to flee – data from Google Trends • Hacker News Board

Re: Russians are trying to flee – data from Google Trends

#171

Post by jacquesm » Sat, Mar 05, 2022, 5:00 PM UTC

drakonka wrote: post #148

therusskiy wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Putin was shaken up by Euromaidan and been preparing so it doesn't happen to him ever since. Ukraine 2014 != Russia 2022. Back then Ukraine even had free speech.

I apologize in advance for some emotion that'll come out in the rest of this comment, but I feel the need to say it. I wish Russian people would then stop telling me all about how most Russians are against Putin and hate him, and then act completely helpless at the thought of doing anything about it. They are just empty words, then, because they're followed by plenty of excuses for inaction. My grandfather is spendin…

And that's the problem right there: most Russians don't hate him. They've been subjected to a decades long barrage of obligatory Putin worship and even today his support is higher than that of the American president. They don't speak any other language than Russian and don't have access to other news sources. This is a real problem, because (1) it all but ensures that this war will last much longer than it should (it shouldn't have started to begin with) and (2) that Russia needs some kind of victory to be able to back out in order to sustain the myth. No such victory can be defined. This makes for a very bleak future.

Meanwhile the West stands by wringing their hands and crying because 'there isn't anything they can do', when in reality they are just scared.

The best bet right now would be for some Russian faction near the seat of power to get rid of Putin once and for all. Of course the instability that would generate would be at least as dangerous as this war, if not more dangerous but it would also have the potential to improve things.

I won't say anything about your grandfather because anything I could say would sound meaningless.

Re: Russians are trying to flee – data from Google Trends

#172

Post by AutumnCurtain » Sat, Mar 05, 2022, 5:00 PM UTC

lolinder wrote: post #61

bsedlm wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

a lot of people seem ok with punishing Russian individuals for the actions of the government. maybe these people have grown in better functioning democracies (unlike Russia or my own country) so they act as if the people were well represented by their governments; unlike reality for most countries with a serious corruption problem.

I'm all for annihilating Russia's economy (even if it means civilians are caught in the crossfire) but the treatment GP received after leaving is extremely disheartening. The goal should be to welcome fleeing Russians with open arms and make it as easy as possible for them to permanently put down roots.

It's also a wasted opportunity just from a competitive standpoint. Brain draining the shit out of Russia is a totally valid strategy that boosts the host nation while hindering Russia.

Re: Russians are trying to flee – data from Google Trends

#173

Post by Mikeb85 » Sat, Mar 05, 2022, 5:01 PM UTC

croes wrote: post #165

Mikeb85 wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Fleeing the country is a strong peaceful revolt on the other hand No, it just ensures that the only people left in Russia are the ones who support Putin. And like I said, Ukrainians have no choice. Why should Russians? As another poster said, even autocracies need a certain level of support to operate. It's not fair to punish Russians but their country is literally waging a full scale war while threatening the west…

Wrong question. If Russians have a choice, why not Ukrainians? People who don't wont to fight are bad as soldiers so why force them?

> Wrong question. If Russians have a choice, why not Ukrainians?

Ask the Russians who are bombing them and preventing them from leaving. Russia has already broken the cease-fire meant to evacuate civilians.

Or ask the Russians who started the war. Ask the Russians carrying out their leadership's orders.

Russians are the ones taking away Ukrainians' choices.

Re: Russians are trying to flee – data from Google Trends

#174

Post by yoavm » Sat, Mar 05, 2022, 5:01 PM UTC

therusskiy wrote: post #115

yoavm wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Repeating the parent comment - What's the option, though? What better things can we do to help the > 1,000,000 Ukrainian refugees, and all the other millions that are currently being bombed by Russia? Putin _is_ getting his power from the Russian people. It's unfortunate they believe his lies, but they do, and that's what makes him strong.

to be honest, I don't know, that is the reason I left, I have no hope and don't know how to change things. What could help is all these companies that are blocking Russians sending information to Russians about this war and about Putin's actions. If all Russians on Google, Playstation and etc saw more information it would help get through the blockade. Companies haven't been doing it because it requires more effort a…

I understand that you are in a difficult position, but western companies using their power to send information to Russians is essentially the same as leaving Russia completely. Do you really have any doubt it would not even take a few hours before they're blocked by Russia? We're all just fast-forwarding this and leaving Russia.

Maybe it will turn people into Putin supporters, and maybe, hopefully, with time, it will push them to revolt.

Re: Russians are trying to flee – data from Google Trends

#175

Post by formvoltron » Sat, Mar 05, 2022, 5:01 PM UTC

mkl95 wrote: post #90

There's nothing surprising about it. There is at least one recent, well documented case of mass emigration due to the economic collapse of an authoritarian regime. Millions of people have left Venezuela since the late 2000s [1]. Considering Russia is barely richer than Spain whilst having 3x the population and the fact it's about to get much worse, I would expect millions of Russians to leave in the next few years. […

Seems like now could be a smart time to get back to Venezuela. Where are these 10M barrels going to come from for the west? And now you have Saudis not entirely taking USA's side in this conflict.

Re: Russians are trying to flee – data from Google Trends

#176

Post by hutzlibu » Sat, Mar 05, 2022, 5:02 PM UTC

Mikeb85 wrote: post #149

asats wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right, if you were in power people fleeing over the berlin wall would have been shot from both sides, not just by the soviets. Cause they should have stayed inside and overthrown the soviet government. Same goes for north koreans, shoot them and send them back, let them fight the government.

The Soviet Union was ended from within... Thanks for proving my point.

And the people who wanted to flee, played their part in it. It is bad for the morale, if you have to shoot your people for wanting to leave. And they did get shot - but not from the other side, too. They were welcomed once they made it. And still it worked.

Re: Russians are trying to flee – data from Google Trends

#177

Post by daenz » Sat, Mar 05, 2022, 5:02 PM UTC

mumblemumble wrote: post #152

daenz wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mentioned in another comment, and I don't want to spam, but I wasn't able to verify their Google search trends claim, using the source country as Russia, and searching both English and Russian translations of the terms they quoted in the article. EDIT>> This is wrong! I am able to confirm the Google Trends data now.

Did you double-check the region in which you're searching? By default it shows trends for where Google thinks you are. I had to use Google Translate to get terms to search in Russian, so take my results with a grain of salt, but, even so, I was generally able to get some nice hockey sticks when I told Google to show me what people in Russia are searching for instead of what Russian-speaking people in the USA are sear…

My first search was the English terms in Russia region. When someone pointed out I should have searched the Russian translation (I assumed Google normalized this), I accidentally switched the region back to US. So both searches had incorrect results. It would have been nice of the economist to include the direct links to the sources they were citing!

Re: Russians are trying to flee – data from Google Trends

#178

Post by fallingfrog » Sat, Mar 05, 2022, 5:02 PM UTC

sAbakumoff wrote: post #141

jmyeet wrote: post #122

Russia is seizing foreign currency reserves (effectively, by forcing conversion to the ruble) held by average Russian citizens. These sanctions are going to be a bad time for them. There are no military options so what else can you do? Still, we shouldn't forget that sanctions are a form of collective punishment that disproportionately affect average citizens. My faint glimmer of hope here is that the West finally ta…

>> My faint glimmer of hope here is that the West finally takes actions to stop enabling oligarchs and they can start with denying them real estate in Western urban centers Recently, Italy seized real estate and other properties of Russian oligarchs and their lackeys, worth ~$150M.

Wish they’d start doing the same with our own oligarchs. Every superyacht is a crime against our children. The amount of resources those absorb that could have been spent combating global warming, on health care, on housing, is just absolutely disgusting. Not to mention the 10000 dollar bottles of champagne, the massive mansions.. so gross.

And if you don’t think we have oligarchs.. why do you think you pay 200 dollars for a vial of insulin? Where do you think all that money goes?

Re: Russians are trying to flee – data from Google Trends

#179

Post by nerkicacy » Sat, Mar 05, 2022, 5:02 PM UTC

Yajirobe wrote: post #72

Tistron wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Everywhere I've seen anyone motivate restrictions on Russian citizens it's been about pushing them to revolt against their government, not about punishing. I don't know whether it makes sense, but it does seem like one of few avenues to try to get rid of putin that has low chance of resulting in atomic war.

Americans about US wars: 'we cannot do anything about our government - they engage in wars and we couldn't stop them if we tried' Americans about Russian wars: 'the average Joes need to go out to the streets and bring Putin down'

Americans can change government during election every few years if they don't like it. Russians can't. That's why the only way is 'the average Joes need to go out to the streets and bring Putin down'.

Re: Russians are trying to flee – data from Google Trends

#180

Post by [deleted] » Sat, Mar 05, 2022, 5:02 PM UTC

Mikeb85 wrote: post #149

asats wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right, if you were in power people fleeing over the berlin wall would have been shot from both sides, not just by the soviets. Cause they should have stayed inside and overthrown the soviet government. Same goes for north koreans, shoot them and send them back, let them fight the government.

The Soviet Union was ended from within... Thanks for proving my point.

[deleted]