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Amazon in talks with HP to buy Palm

venturebeat.com

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Re: Amazon in talks with HP to buy Palm

#31

Post by eurleif »

avree wrote: post #16
modeless wrote: post #14

What would Amazon do with WebOS when they have already invested so much in Android? Switching would require them to abandon the app store they built. The Silk browser seems at odds with how WebOS works. All their Android UI customizations would have to be rewritten.

Amazon has shown that they're open to pivots and trying new things before. I wouldn't be surprised if they made two different lines of Kindles, with different OS's. They are trying to achieve market dominance with the Amazon App Store—with WebOS they could truly achieve market dominance since they'd be the main source of apps.

But the Kindle Fire is supposed to be an appliance. It's supposed to Just Work. Adding a second tablet with a different OS would confuse Amazon's target audience.

Re: Amazon in talks with HP to buy Palm

#32

Post by octover »

nodata wrote: post #30
MichaelApproved wrote: post #27

With Fire, Amazon essentially has an independent OS. The only reason to by Palm would be that Google will not protect you as an Android maker and you need your own patent portfolio to defend yourself.

Didn't Amazon work with Google to create the Fire?

No, they didn't. The biggest sign you can see out in the open is that the Fire is running a fork of 2.3 Gingerbread instead of 3.0 Honeycomb or the upcoming Ice Cream Sandwich.

Re: Amazon in talks with HP to buy Palm

#33

Post by j_col »

vanadium wrote: post #28
j_col wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Amazon has probably 10 times that many Kindle users or more already Kindle users may very well prove to be a different demographic than tablet users. If they sell 10 million Fires then they will probably be out-selling iPads in that space, can't see that happening. A lot of Kindle users will stick to Kindle because they just want to read books on an e-ink screen. > Also, if you think WebOS is somehow immune to the…

You realize most of Palm's pre-webOS patents weren't even owned by Palm by the time it was sold to HP, right? These guys (formerly Palmsource) own most of them: http://www.access-company.com/ All that's left are the webOS-centric patents for the most part, and patent applications such as the card metaphor (which would put QNX in a REALLY bad position if granted) are still pending.

Take a look at this from back in 2009 when Apple were raising the possibility of sueing Palm over the original Pre being too close to their iPhone (according to them):

http://technologizer.com/2009/01/23/palm-responds-to-apple-i...

Of course this never happened, because to quote Palm at the time:

"Palm has a long history of innovation that is reflected in our products and robust patent portfolio, and we have long been recognized for our fundamental patents in the mobile space. If faced with legal action, we are confident that we have the tools necessary to defend ourselves."

Note that this statement was written well after the spin-off of Palmsource.

Re: Amazon in talks with HP to buy Palm

#34

Post by [deleted] »

j_col wrote: post #15

As a long-suffering webOS fan (Pre- through to Pre3 & Touchpad), all I have to say to this news is, yay! WebOS is a fantastic system that does not deserve to linger and die due to HP's lack of leadership and vision. Jeff Bezzos, on the other hand, is a true visionary in my opinion and I would be happy to see my webOS HP Profile become an Amazon profile sometime soon. My only doubt though: will they make phones?

[deleted]

Re: Amazon in talks with HP to buy Palm

#35

Post by j_col »

vanadium wrote: post #29
modeless wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Now patents might be a good reason to buy Palm, but that's completely separate from the fate of WebOS. Amazon could take the patents and throw WebOS away.

I could see Amazon using the card metaphor as a custom multitasking Android launcher with full power of a pending patent application behind it while ditching the remainder of the OS. It's the one distinction webOS has had in UX and one that's generally garnered the most positive attention. I could not, however, see Amazon hedging on Android by holding webOS in state. That would be a rather insane move given the audie…

What about Dalvik and the on-going Oracle case? webOS has no Java, there is another distinction for you. It's the full stack in webOS that is unique, not just the UI.

Re: Amazon in talks with HP to buy Palm

#36

Post by vanadium »

j_col wrote: post #33
vanadium wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You realize most of Palm's pre-webOS patents weren't even owned by Palm by the time it was sold to HP, right? These guys (formerly Palmsource) own most of them: http://www.access-company.com/ All that's left are the webOS-centric patents for the most part, and patent applications such as the card metaphor (which would put QNX in a REALLY bad position if granted) are still pending.

Take a look at this from back in 2009 when Apple were raising the possibility of sueing Palm over the original Pre being too close to their iPhone (according to them): http://technologizer.com/2009/01/23/palm-responds-to-apple-i... Of course this never happened, because to quote Palm at the time: "Palm has a long history of innovation that is reflected in our products and robust patent portfolio, and we have long bee…

It's not difficult to ascertain that ACCESS/Palmsource very likely granted unconditional use of the patents to the existing Palm that sold those very patents to them, therefore giving it basically unfettered rights to defend itself against Apple in this scenario.

Re: Amazon in talks with HP to buy Palm

#37

Post by vanadium »

j_col wrote: post #35
vanadium wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I could see Amazon using the card metaphor as a custom multitasking Android launcher with full power of a pending patent application behind it while ditching the remainder of the OS. It's the one distinction webOS has had in UX and one that's generally garnered the most positive attention. I could not, however, see Amazon hedging on Android by holding webOS in state. That would be a rather insane move given the audie…

What about Dalvik and the on-going Oracle case? webOS has no Java, there is another distinction for you. It's the full stack in webOS that is unique, not just the UI.

That's partially true; webOS 3.0 has no Java as far as I'm aware, deferring to node.js for its services instead. webOS prior to that (e.g., Mojo era) contains an absolute trove of Java all over the damned place. I remember dissecting the media system looking for private APIs in parallel with developing a webOS application and many points led right back to Java-based services that assisted in doing a lot of perfunctory tasks.

In fact, I distinctly remember asking the Palm webOS developers when I discovered in their Java-based media services a particular call that instantly parsed SHOUTcast/Icecast-style playlists of many various formats with ease whether it'd become a public API call. It never did.

If HP races to finally reconcile the two sides as a promised a half-year ago a la Android's ICS, then there might be no obstacles to the Java argument. Until then, however...

Re: Amazon in talks with HP to buy Palm

#39

Post by potatolicious »

rkalla wrote: post #2

We saw the launch of the Kindle Fire and have seen Amazon's hand with the custom build of Android that looks/feels nothing like Android... anyone have any guesses why they would want WebOS? Amazon already has the Android store, all the Android integration done for the Fire and the Java/Android expertise in house... where does WebOS fit in?

Does it have to be the webOS division? I'd imagine Amazon wouldn't have that much interest in Palm's software, but Palm is also one of the few entities in North America that has experience designing hardware from end to end.

We know that Amazon had to outsource the design and build of the Fire to an outsider, no doubt it would be preferable to bring that in-house to a team of world class industrial designers.

Re: Amazon in talks with HP to buy Palm

#40

Post by wheels »

modeless wrote: post #14

What would Amazon do with WebOS when they have already invested so much in Android? Switching would require them to abandon the app store they built. The Silk browser seems at odds with how WebOS works. All their Android UI customizations would have to be rewritten.

My guess is a bunch of embedded Linux hackers and a large patent portfolio, which relative other vendors they're quite short on. Maybe webOS would be recycled as an OS for the ePaper products or something, but I wouldn't bet on its future even if it does go over to Amazon.

Even so it's a hard deal for me to get my head around. Amazon is not an acquisition-happy company. There's usually very clear alignment and they've never done a big talent acquisition, so I suspect there'd have to be something very specific that they're after.

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