Live data from Hacker News

How “latency numbers everybody should know” decreased from 1990–2020

colin-scott.github.io

201–210 of 225 posts

Re: How “latency numbers everybody should know” decreased from 1990–2020

#201

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Can you explain how to square that with the link saying compressing data hasn't gotten any faster since 2005? Compression may be bottlenecked by ram (L2 or L3 cache) access speed, or maybe even dram (main memory) access speed.

I have an i7-3770k and an i9-12900k sitting here. Do you know of a benchmark I could run myself that would give me the same results on both CPUs?

sleep 1?

Re: How “latency numbers everybody should know” decreased from 1990–2020

#202

I wish there was a version that normalized the times somehow instead of showing absolute times. Most of these numbers will get smaller simply because CPUs get faster, but it would be super helpful to get an accurate read whether the ratios of e.g. l1 to l2 to l3 to main memory lookup latencies changed significantly.

[deleted]

Re: How “latency numbers everybody should know” decreased from 1990–2020

#203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The parent comment said no one uses drives strictly faster than 7200.

Pretty sure 10K RPM drives are used too.

They're used, but rare because they got to a weird position in between slower drives that are cheaper to produce and operate and SSDs. E.g. 15K RPM drives were a thing but while you can still buy some models they're typically more expensive than SSDs, so you mostly buy them to replace drives in existing arrays.

Re: How “latency numbers everybody should know” decreased from 1990–2020

#204
post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, at the speed of light 150 ms is about long enough to send a packet from SF to Amsterdam and then send the reply back the long way around the entire rest of the planet.

https://wondernetwork.com/pings/San%20Francisco

Yes, that shows that the time could theoretically be roughly halved without even bothering to transmit in a medium with faster propagation than glass fiber.

Re: How “latency numbers everybody should know” decreased from 1990–2020

#205
post #56

An instructive thing here is that a lot of stuff has not improved since ~2004 or so, and working around those things that have not improved (memory latency from ram all the way down to l1 cache really) requires fine control of memory layout and minimizing cache pollution, which is difficult to do with all of our popular garbage collected languages, even harder with languages that don't offer memory layout controls, a…

It's pretty remarkable that, for efficient data processing, it's super super important to care about memory layout / cache locality in intimate detail, and this will probably be true until something fundamental changes about our computing model. Yet somehow this is fairly obscure knowledge unless you're into serious game programming or a similar field.

Why can’t we abstract over this and optimize per system in runtime?

Re: How “latency numbers everybody should know” decreased from 1990–2020

#207
post #56

An instructive thing here is that a lot of stuff has not improved since ~2004 or so, and working around those things that have not improved (memory latency from ram all the way down to l1 cache really) requires fine control of memory layout and minimizing cache pollution, which is difficult to do with all of our popular garbage collected languages, even harder with languages that don't offer memory layout controls, a…

It's pretty remarkable that, for efficient data processing, it's super super important to care about memory layout / cache locality in intimate detail, and this will probably be true until something fundamental changes about our computing model. Yet somehow this is fairly obscure knowledge unless you're into serious game programming or a similar field.

I'm always disappointed that no one has come up with a more realistic model for asymptotic time complexity comparisons, one using a computation model with asymptotically increasing memory access times.

It's a pretty sad state of affairs when the main way we talk about algorithm performance suggests that traversing a linked list is as fast as traversing an array.

Re: How “latency numbers everybody should know” decreased from 1990–2020

#208
post #48
post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We really need to go back to 1 supercontinent

Direct point to point conduits carrying fiber would reduce latency to a worst case of 21ms, but requires a fiber that doesn't melt at core temps (around 5200C).

Is it easy to dig down to the core, apart from the temperature issues?

Re: How “latency numbers everybody should know” decreased from 1990–2020

#209

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, RAM is significantly faster than even SSD, and now I don't have to muck about w/ a 2nd drive :) Not to mention the spinning rust is cheaper.

Sure, but that RAM isn't :) I can get a 60gb ssd for under 20 bucks (I just checked 18.99 on amazon - even I'm a little surprised at how cheap that is) That 32gb of ram is at least a crisp hundred (which also - fucking mind blowing. First time I ever added a part to a PC, it was to add 256mb of ram, and that was huge deal)

> First time I ever added a part to a PC, it was to add 256mb of ram, and that was huge deal

I remember the first memory stick I bought (a measly 4mb of RAM) and even wholesale via a friend who worked for a large PC repair shop, it was still $450 give or take.

Now 30 years later, my most recent memory purchase was eight 32gb ECC RDIMMs for about the same price. So not only did the amount of ram per dollar increase 64,000x, it’s also WAY faster and more resilient.

Re: How “latency numbers everybody should know” decreased from 1990–2020

#210
post #27

Amazing performance improvements, except no improvement at all on the packet roundtrip time to Netherlands. Someone should really work on that.

The great circle distance between SF and Amsterdam is about 5,450 miles. A round trip is 10,900 miles. At the speed of light, that's 58.5 milliseconds. So in theory, infinitely efficient computers (and some sort of light-in-a-vacuum wire) and networking equipment could knock 60% off that time, but no more. However, I suspect one big problem is that there are a number of hops between the Netherlands and San Francisco.…

> I'm curious what the actual route is be and how many miles are involved.

There’s tons of possible routes, but here is a probable one:

SFO -> NJ -> UK -> NL -> AMS = ~6,250mi one way minimum GC distance, probably closer to 7k-7,500mi in reality

The majority of transatlantic landings are along the Jersey shore, but could also be Long Island, NY, or Boston / Virginia Beach vicinity too.

Post reply on HN