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Google mandates workers back to Silicon Valley, other offices from April 4

reuters.com

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Re: Google mandates workers back to Silicon Valley, other offices from April 4

#691

Post by bitcharmer »

InitialLastName wrote: post #634
Fezzik wrote: post #453

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the one thing that has unequivocally been proven though is that it works . To what degree it fits/supports peoples’ subjective state of mind is up for argument, but most professions got by just as they did prior to the pandemic. Heck, I’m a trial attorney and I never thought remote work would be feasible. After doing multiple 3+ day trials entirely by WebEx I never want to go back to a courtroom. I can skip s…

> I think the one thing that has unequivocally been proven though is that it works. It certainly works in the short term, in an emergency situation where everybody in a sector is operating under the same conditions out of necessity. Whether it has long-term detrimental effects remains to be determined. My team at a small-medium company that a roughly 1-day-per-week work from home policy before 2020 certainly feels le…

> My team at a small-medium company that a roughly 1-day-per-week work from home policy before 2020 certainly feels less cohesive, efficient, and innovative than it did in the past.

Have you maybe considered that it's actually not your team's fault but rather how the organisation transitioned into and approached remote working? That or you're an MBA :)

Re: Google mandates workers back to Silicon Valley, other offices from April 4

#692

Post by codemac »

5350-uiop-1130 wrote: post #669
librish wrote: post #84

I think anyone who's claiming that remote work has been "proven" to be better or worse is wrong. There are some studies but they use estimations and proxies, carrying the same flaws as doing performance reviews based on lines of code. We've proven that the big tech companies can go fully remote and not completely crash and burn, that's about it. Some people love the lack of commute and less semi-forced hanging out, s…

People should have an option to go fully remote, not be forced to do X number of days because reasons. This is the problem that remote work solves. It gives you some sense of autonomy so that you don't feel like a completely subservient slave. Also you said objectively it has not been proven but your subjective opinion is that it's better to be in office. What I will counter is that remote is almost certainly better…

> People should have an option to go fully remote, not be forced to do X number of days because reasons.

This.. this is exactly what Google did - everyone had the option to go fully remote.

Re: Google mandates workers back to Silicon Valley, other offices from April 4

#693

Post by bitcharmer »

bradyd wrote: post #502
paulcole wrote: post #420

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The comment you’re replying to has nothing to do with response time. They’re specifying their preference for in-person communication even though it may affect individual productivity. I 100% agree with them. I’m more productive as a remote employee, my coworkers seem to greatly prefer remote work, and there is a 0% chance the next job I pursue will be at a remote company. It’s just not my preference.

>> The comment you’re replying to has nothing to do with response time. I think you just hit the nail on the head right there. There are a few things that I've realized make the difference between remote work and in person. When you are needing to talk to a team mate, working remotely you can just message them and get a response quickly, but this has the effect of interrupting them (or you), which can derail their tr…

> When you are needing to talk to a team mate, working remotely you can just message them and get a response quickly, but this has the effect of interrupting them (or you), which can derail their train of thought. Sure, your still interrupting them when in person, but you can see that they are actively working on something and wait a minute or two for them to notice

You're wrong. When I need to stay focused on something I may ignore messages and be 100% productive. However when I'm at the office most people don't care if I'm working on something with my headphones on, clearly in the zone. They'll just approach me about the most benign matters most of which can wait for days even.

Re: Google mandates workers back to Silicon Valley, other offices from April 4

#694

Post by winternett »

librish wrote: post #84

I think anyone who's claiming that remote work has been "proven" to be better or worse is wrong. There are some studies but they use estimations and proxies, carrying the same flaws as doing performance reviews based on lines of code. We've proven that the big tech companies can go fully remote and not completely crash and burn, that's about it. Some people love the lack of commute and less semi-forced hanging out, s…

Remote is neither better nor worse. The problem is that we're still clearly not past the Covid threat, and a rush to bring everyone back together to spur economic activity downtown (based on tax revenue it will generate) will create a lot of technical debt if it is timed wrong.

We need to have better productivity tools. No one has leveraged text to speech well in work communication, but somehow YouTube and TikTok can transcribe any video via AI... No one has innovated a cost effective way to update office ventilation properly, and workspaces to prevent the spread of contaminants, no one has invented a fool-proof vaccination that completely prevents infection... I'm not saying any of that could or should happen first, but nothing has really changed about workspaces, yet leadership is still expecting new results without further lockdown to make them feel better about paying ridiculous fees for their massively uninhabited work campuses.

The Pandemic created a situation in which very very basic (and in many cases dated) tech was foisted upon us for over 2 years as "new innovation", but it's simply not. The MetaVerse is a rehash of the Sims (or any other networked RPG game you can pick with avatars) which has now been out for ages, Clubhouse was basically an Internet conference call, WhatsApp is basically a group text/social media rehash, Twitch is basically a video stream and live chat site, and IG stories and TikTok are just a faster way to scroll through mostly edited/reposted YouTube video content, Most web conference tools are all pretty much Facebook with Skype on top of it, And Web 3 is the absolute scammiest most overly-abstract pyramid scheme ever foisted on our grandparents since Amway as well...

We are simply not innovating any more and there is a major ruse over that fact pulled by the entire IT industry) driven of course by the constant need to drive investment hype... And we're putting everything behind paywalls now so much that most of it is becoming pure clickbait, even on well known news sites.

We're praising people for marginally recycling old ideas now more than ever. We're also all paying way too much for the underwhelming mediocrity of it all. Take a look at how every year most of the latest tech advancement going on with mobile and other software-driven devices is the ability for major corps to better track and harvest data on everyone. Data mining, subscription services, and embedded advertisements are nowhere near as profitable as true innovation, but somehow most companies are even stuck on even rehashing those old ideas and calling them "winning".

If we could just fix all that s*it and get back to true innovation and listening to, funding, and hiring people that truly deliver real innovative results, the working world would be better in remote work mode, and it would connect us all better as if we were in an office with less risks and without another lockdown to no sort of accountability from decision makers again.

Re: Google mandates workers back to Silicon Valley, other offices from April 4

#695

Post by lol_me »

codemac wrote: post #692
5350-uiop-1130 wrote: post #669

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People should have an option to go fully remote, not be forced to do X number of days because reasons. This is the problem that remote work solves. It gives you some sense of autonomy so that you don't feel like a completely subservient slave. Also you said objectively it has not been proven but your subjective opinion is that it's better to be in office. What I will counter is that remote is almost certainly better…

> People should have an option to go fully remote, not be forced to do X number of days because reasons. This.. this is exactly what Google did - everyone had the option to go fully remote.

nobody said otherwise?

Re: Google mandates workers back to Silicon Valley, other offices from April 4

#696

Post by dt3ft »

nannal wrote: post #686
5350-uiop-1130 wrote: post #669

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People should have an option to go fully remote, not be forced to do X number of days because reasons. This is the problem that remote work solves. It gives you some sense of autonomy so that you don't feel like a completely subservient slave. Also you said objectively it has not been proven but your subjective opinion is that it's better to be in office. What I will counter is that remote is almost certainly better…

> What I will counter is that remote is almost certainly better for the environment and social mobility Neither of which have an appreciable business use in the near to mid term & are therefore totally irrelevant to an employer.

To the contrary, I prefer to work for employers who are kind to the environment and I'm quite sure my entire generation feels the same. In fact, I long for the day when the last business harmful to the environment shuts its doors.

Re: Google mandates workers back to Silicon Valley, other offices from April 4

#698

Post by catach »

nannal wrote: post #686
5350-uiop-1130 wrote: post #669

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People should have an option to go fully remote, not be forced to do X number of days because reasons. This is the problem that remote work solves. It gives you some sense of autonomy so that you don't feel like a completely subservient slave. Also you said objectively it has not been proven but your subjective opinion is that it's better to be in office. What I will counter is that remote is almost certainly better…

> What I will counter is that remote is almost certainly better for the environment and social mobility Neither of which have an appreciable business use in the near to mid term & are therefore totally irrelevant to an employer.

In a competitive job market, employers are motivated to care about that which attracts and retains employees.

Re: Google mandates workers back to Silicon Valley, other offices from April 4

#699

Post by namdnay »

5350-uiop-1130 wrote: post #669
librish wrote: post #84

I think anyone who's claiming that remote work has been "proven" to be better or worse is wrong. There are some studies but they use estimations and proxies, carrying the same flaws as doing performance reviews based on lines of code. We've proven that the big tech companies can go fully remote and not completely crash and burn, that's about it. Some people love the lack of commute and less semi-forced hanging out, s…

People should have an option to go fully remote, not be forced to do X number of days because reasons. This is the problem that remote work solves. It gives you some sense of autonomy so that you don't feel like a completely subservient slave. Also you said objectively it has not been proven but your subjective opinion is that it's better to be in office. What I will counter is that remote is almost certainly better…

> so that you don't feel like a completely subservient slave

Are we still talking about Google?

Re: Google mandates workers back to Silicon Valley, other offices from April 4

#700

Post by ddlutz »

lol_me wrote: post #695
codemac wrote: post #692

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> People should have an option to go fully remote, not be forced to do X number of days because reasons. This.. this is exactly what Google did - everyone had the option to go fully remote.

nobody said otherwise?

The title does "Google mandates workers ...". Have to read further to know there is an option.
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