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My Stripe Tax Story

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Re: My Stripe Tax Story

#51
post #37
post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Please consider a financial goodwill payment instead of only sending updated CSVs. You charge an extra fee for Stripe Tax; your paying product had an issue.

“Remediations” often refers to exactly that. Would suggest we wait for an update from the author to see how Stripe handles that, if at all.

If there are remediations, it might likely be done under NDA for legal reasons, so we may never hear anything back.

Re: My Stripe Tax Story

#52
post #47

Sad to see Stripe fall to the bean counters instead of staying focused on customers. They were coming out with some cool innovations a few years ago. Even "don't be evil" Google is moving in this direction. Not sure why companies always evolve this way. Boeing is another prime example. Apple has maintained its focus on the customer and thrived, bucking the trend, which seems like it would be motivation for others to…

I would only have to assume you haven't ran a business with over $2M ARR. Taxes, VAT, etc is a HUGE pain in the ass.

It's been a long time for Stripe to introduce a solution for taxes after it was requested by lots of customers (and recently acquired TaxJar because of it)

Re: My Stripe Tax Story

#53

My dad owns a successful chain of bicycle stores in Texas. He’s been in business for almost 51 years and he’s one of the largest bike dealers by volume in the country. He has nearly a hundred employees and a bookkeeper. Despite having a proverbial dozen balls in the air at any time and despite having people on the payroll to do bookkeeping, he sits down at his computer every night at home, logs into the ERP system, a…

One more thing to add to this: scrutinizing transactions isn’t just for catching bad stuff. It’s also a way to spot the good. For my dad, it’s a way to spot up-and-coming salespeople who are punching above their weight, for noticing high-dollar sales to repeat customers and making sure that those folks are well cared-for. It also tells him what bikes are selling well and helps him make strategic decisions for buying.…

To be fair, in this case, the author was tracking his KPIs, and those suggested that all was hunky dory, but what he wasn’t tracking were the actual payments being received against invoices that never converted to an open state. In this case, the invoices were left in a draft state on Stripe’s side. And who could’ve expected that they’d need to occasionally check for draft invoices?

It seems like it wasn’t made clear in the docs that invoices aren’t finalized in these circumstances until later.

Re: My Stripe Tax Story

#54
post #34
post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tech support gaslighting. Perfect encapsulation of the phenomenon. Someone make an urban dictionary entry.

No, I didn't change anything. It just started working again.

An easy claim to make in the world of service auto-scaling and auto-replacement :)

Re: My Stripe Tax Story

#55

My dad owns a successful chain of bicycle stores in Texas. He’s been in business for almost 51 years and he’s one of the largest bike dealers by volume in the country. He has nearly a hundred employees and a bookkeeper. Despite having a proverbial dozen balls in the air at any time and despite having people on the payroll to do bookkeeping, he sits down at his computer every night at home, logs into the ERP system, a…

> he sits down at his computer every night at home, logs into the ERP system, and reviews sales and receipts

Sorry, what?

How is this OK or even normalized - he should not have to check every single receipt every night. You hire people to do that, and if they cannot do it right, you hire someone else.

As OP mentioned, it wasn't a gradual thing, and when you have a lot of customers, it can easily slip through. Even your father would be the same here - if a few people who should have been charged a recurring bill did not, how would he remember that?

> Every good business owner does it.

Absolutely not. Every good business owner gets someone to take care of it, and then double checks their work at times.

Re: My Stripe Tax Story

#56
post #47

Sad to see Stripe fall to the bean counters instead of staying focused on customers. They were coming out with some cool innovations a few years ago. Even "don't be evil" Google is moving in this direction. Not sure why companies always evolve this way. Boeing is another prime example. Apple has maintained its focus on the customer and thrived, bucking the trend, which seems like it would be motivation for others to…

You're making some huge hand wavy statements based on this single anecdote...

Re: My Stripe Tax Story

#57
post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One more thing to add to this: scrutinizing transactions isn’t just for catching bad stuff. It’s also a way to spot the good. For my dad, it’s a way to spot up-and-coming salespeople who are punching above their weight, for noticing high-dollar sales to repeat customers and making sure that those folks are well cared-for. It also tells him what bikes are selling well and helps him make strategic decisions for buying.…

To be fair, in this case, the author was tracking his KPIs, and those suggested that all was hunky dory, but what he wasn’t tracking were the actual payments being received against invoices that never converted to an open state. In this case, the invoices were left in a draft state on Stripe’s side. And who could’ve expected that they’d need to occasionally check for draft invoices? It seems like it wasn’t made clear…

This sounds like something good old fashioned double-entry bookkeeping would have caught immediately (hunky dory income from Stripe seemingly falling into a black hole). No need to scrutinize every transaction until you notice the ledger isn't adding up.

Re: My Stripe Tax Story

#58

I also had issues with stripe's automatic tax. We use stripe's subscriptions with free trials but don't collect credit card details up front, preferring to make sign up simple and low friction. Automatic tax is charged at 0.5% of each transaction, and apparently a trial ending is considered a transaction even if the user has no payment method, so we were hit with automatic tax fees for every trial end even if we rece…

Could you email me at edwin@stripe.com and we can dig a bit more into this?

Hi Edwin, I appreciate you offering. I did message support about this but it pretty quickly hit the limit of the time I was willing to put in to try and retrieve the money we lost (which wasn't all that much). It is one of those things where the way Stripe charges is technically correct as you need to calculate tax for all transactions even if they aren't fulfilled. But the odd behavior of trying to charge at end of trial even if a user doesn't have a payment method combined with charging 0.5% of all transactions whether fulfilled or not results in a pretty unexpected outcome. Changing any one of these behaviors, or even making the documentation clearer would stop this happening to anyone else probably.

Re: My Stripe Tax Story

#59
post #3

(I work at Stripe.) This was a painful read. I'm sorry. We could have done a lot better. We're working on remediations now, and we're sending another, corrected email tonight with the updated CSV file of failed invoices as of March 1st.

[deleted]

Re: My Stripe Tax Story

#60
post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To be fair, in this case, the author was tracking his KPIs, and those suggested that all was hunky dory, but what he wasn’t tracking were the actual payments being received against invoices that never converted to an open state. In this case, the invoices were left in a draft state on Stripe’s side. And who could’ve expected that they’d need to occasionally check for draft invoices? It seems like it wasn’t made clear…

This sounds like something good old fashioned double-entry bookkeeping would have caught immediately (hunky dory income from Stripe seemingly falling into a black hole). No need to scrutinize every transaction until you notice the ledger isn't adding up.

It sounds like a classic example of how accrual bookkeeping can be misleading due to timing issues (the sale has already been booked even though the cash hasn’t been collected). I know it has other advantages vs. cash bookkeeping, but cash is so much easier to understand that I have always chosen it whenever possible (i.e., for a service business).
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