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Write plain text files

sive.rs

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Re: Write plain text files

#41

Post by bob1029 »

imgabe wrote: post #35

Another advantage to plain text files: source control. You can check your writing into git and get a history of all your edits. It’s something programmers take for granted, but it would be amazing if this got more widely adopted outside of tech. The number of files with names like “Report Final Final draft v3.docx” is truly staggering. “Git for everything“ would be a multi-billion dollar startup easily.

> “Git for everything“ would be a multi-billion dollar startup easily.

In addition to plaintext documents, I have found that a simple JSON diff is also a very effective way to demonstrate changes between 2 complex biz objects. Non-developers can cope with this as long as the differences are visually obvious (red=removed, green=new, etc) and the object graph is reasonably flat. Everything can be trivially serialized to a JSON document, so this scales super well in my experience. We use a port of Google's DiffMatchPatch to generate human-friendly HTML reports of object diffs in our latest administration tools.

Re: Write plain text files

#42

Post by _ofdw »

chrisweekly wrote: post #36
jasode wrote: post #34

>If you rely on Word, Evernote or Notion, for example, then you can’t work unless you have Word, Evernote, or Notion. You are helpless without them. You are dependent. Although I deliberately avoid Evernote and Notion for those stated reasons, I'm fine with Microsoft Word. I've been using it for 20 years. It even opens my proprietary DOS WordPerfect ("*.wp") files from 1980s! Sometimes I need more flexible layout of…

"Markdown isn't an alternative." Strongest possible respectful disagreement. --- ^ orig comment above, edits below (I was interrupted when 1st commenting; apologies to anyone who responded to the short version) --- See eg Obsidian ( https://obsidian.md ) for a great example. It's astonishing how feature-rich it's become. WYSIWYG editor, Excalidraw integration, Slid.es, etc etc etc. And if you have any webdev chops at…

Markdown is actually awful. There's at least 3 different dialects that are all called Markdown, so if you want your text rendered it's a toss-up as to whether or not it'll look how you intend.

I think that Markdown's success is due to a lack of a widely-used, simple alternative that's well-specified.

Org is easily and objectively the best markup but of course it's only very very recently that there was a non-emacs implement worth a damn.

Re: Write plain text files

#43

Post by westcort »

Some key points:

--There will always be plenty of free, non-commercial software in the public domain for reading and editing text files

--Whether future virtual reality, or a chip you can implant in your earlobe, plain text will be there

--Maybe it’s just another distraction, focusing on the tools instead of your thinking

--They offer some convenience or features, but at the cost of flexibility, portability, and independence

This is why I still love my AlphaSmart Dana running CardTXT. I have done a lot of writing with that machine, and it has never let me down. Even if it did, I could just swap out the SD card.

Re: Write plain text files

#44

Post by vdqtp3 »

josephg wrote: post #18
andrewclunn wrote: post #9

Is there a modern text editor that only supports ASCII, so I can take my plain text notes and store pages and pages of them in one or two KB?

Maybe, but there's no reason to use an ASCII-only text editor. (Almost) all modern text editors use UTF-8. And UTF-8 stores all the characters in the 7 bit ASCII table the same way ASCII does. The result of that is, so long as you don't add any emoji or anything to your documents, a 2022 version of VS Code will store your text files in the same format as vi did in 1976.

Until you copy and paste from a website that is using em dash, en dash or smart quotes...

Re: Write plain text files

#45

Post by falcolas »

jasode wrote: post #34

>If you rely on Word, Evernote or Notion, for example, then you can’t work unless you have Word, Evernote, or Notion. You are helpless without them. You are dependent. Although I deliberately avoid Evernote and Notion for those stated reasons, I'm fine with Microsoft Word. I've been using it for 20 years. It even opens my proprietary DOS WordPerfect ("*.wp") files from 1980s! Sometimes I need more flexible layout of…

HTML works quite well for images and text placement. Latex (and its derivatives) work even better.

Word isn't bad, so long as you keep paying your subscription.

Re: Write plain text files

#46

Post by Seirdy »

imgabe wrote: post #35

Another advantage to plain text files: source control. You can check your writing into git and get a history of all your edits. It’s something programmers take for granted, but it would be amazing if this got more widely adopted outside of tech. The number of files with names like “Report Final Final draft v3.docx” is truly staggering. “Git for everything“ would be a multi-billion dollar startup easily.

Yeah, in high school I and another student did our essay peer reviews using annotated diffs once. It was so much easier than Google Docs, since we didn't have to leave our editors.

Wrapping version control with a non-tech-friendly porcelain could help a lot of people escape user domestication from vendor lock-in.

Re: Write plain text files

#47

Post by yarky »

imgabe wrote: post #35

Another advantage to plain text files: source control. You can check your writing into git and get a history of all your edits. It’s something programmers take for granted, but it would be amazing if this got more widely adopted outside of tech. The number of files with names like “Report Final Final draft v3.docx” is truly staggering. “Git for everything“ would be a multi-billion dollar startup easily.

I was actually surprised : last time I used Git Bash on Windows it did work quite well with .docx files.

Then I switched jobs to avoid touching .docx files ...

The best alternative I've found to generate .docx output is R markdown, which uses pandoc under the hood and let's you program the whole document the way LaTeX would.

Re: Write plain text files

#48

Post by wrycoder »

civilized wrote: post #16
peterxpark wrote: post #2

I've tried a lot of different things over decades. And, after countless experimentation, I'm still at the same place... I store data all over the place. I have Evernote for long book notes and tracking financial data. I'm using notion right now as my base of notes for learning how to build a cabin (toggles and embedding videos is wonderful). I tried to really use roam and its off-shots for a while but could never rea…

Everyone was talking about Roam for a while, I wonder what happened.

Maybe they all switched to Obsidian or org mode.

Re: Write plain text files

#49

Post by saintaardvark »

e-dt wrote: post #33

I think that this can be expanded beyond just "only use plain text for important documents". I think the heart of it is really, "use only proven, open (preferably standardised) formats for important files." E.g. Markdown is a proven format (plain-text-readable but not strictly plain text), so it is likely to stay readable for a long time, and it is an open format, so you can use it right now without paying for propri…

You've got it exactly right. Years ago, I wrote "Any sufficiently important information must be indistinguishable from plain text", and your point is what I was trying to get at: if it's that important, make sure the format you use has tools that are as helpful, flexible, and degradation-resistant as those available for plain text.

Re: Write plain text files

#50

Post by Seirdy »

_ofdw wrote: post #42
chrisweekly wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Markdown isn't an alternative." Strongest possible respectful disagreement. --- ^ orig comment above, edits below (I was interrupted when 1st commenting; apologies to anyone who responded to the short version) --- See eg Obsidian ( https://obsidian.md ) for a great example. It's astonishing how feature-rich it's become. WYSIWYG editor, Excalidraw integration, Slid.es, etc etc etc. And if you have any webdev chops at…

Markdown is actually awful. There's at least 3 different dialects that are all called Markdown, so if you want your text rendered it's a toss-up as to whether or not it'll look how you intend. I think that Markdown's success is due to a lack of a widely-used, simple alternative that's well-specified. Org is easily and objectively the best markup but of course it's only very very recently that there was a non-emacs im…

Then pick a standardized dialect. Commonmark is the lowest common denominator; GFM is useful for when you need some extra features. Markdown also allows HTML for whenever you need something fancy.

The advantage of markdown isn't robustness, it's simplicity. Preteens can get a handle on it in minutes when using Reddit.

The main benefit that all these markup-shorthands serve IMO is getting people to add meaning semantically rather than with presentation. Word processor users typically adjust font size and color to make headings, even when given a list of headings right in the ribbon. Markdown is just an HTML shorthand: you can only work with semantic meaning.

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