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Why not hire part-time developers?

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Re: Why not hire part-time developers?

#121

Post by kuboble »

the_gipsy wrote: post #81
kuboble wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In Switzerland it is extremely popular to work part-time in IT. To the point that most men I know have reduced to 4/5 when they became parents and most women to 3/5. The deal in companies is that it's relatively easy to reduce your work % but it's a one way street. To get back your manager needs to find a budget the same way as if they were hiring (but I don't know anyone who did want to increase it back). Seems to w…

Are these figures x/5 weekdays, a range of daily hours, or something else?

Depends on the company but I've seen all possible deals. - 4x8h a week - 5x6h a week - fully flexible 50% to reach each quarter

Re: Why not hire part-time developers?

#122

Post by the-alchemist »

PythagoRascal wrote: post #99
the_gipsy wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are these figures x/5 weekdays, a range of daily hours, or something else?

In Switzerland jobs are usually advertised in %, where 40h-45h/week is 100%. From that it is also usual to talk about 80% or 4/5days/week (and so on for other percentages).

Fascinating! I heard the Netherlands has a strong part-time job culture too.

Re: Why not hire part-time developers?

#123

Post by the-alchemist »

BadCookie wrote: post #108
me_me_mu_mu wrote: post #33

Don't see this working in USA. I've never been to Europe, but work with many who are from there. You get socialized healthcare, cities with easy transit, and for the most part things are close. In the US, we don't have health insurance unless we buy it ourselves ($$$$) or our company provides it ($). We don't have easy transit in most cities, and also people do live far away from the business centers. That's why in t…

The ACA made it possible to go part-time in the US. It costs just over $1k/month for my family of three for a silver plan with no subsidies.

In addition, I heard in some states (CA, I think?), even a single member LLC has to be offered the same group rate for health insurance that other small-company (Maybe someone can confirm.

Re: Why not hire part-time developers?

#124

Post by ozim »

yibg wrote: post #118
qrohlf wrote: post #10

I experienced this in the extreme recently. I'm a very experienced dev in a very in-demand field. Money is not a huge priority for me in my career. Flexibility is. I have a proven track record of success in part-time roles after converting to part time at my previous company (after 2 years of full-time, of course). I spent 3+ months trying to get part-time engagements, and was willing to consider both consulting and…

We’ve tried part time developers, but so far haven’t been able to do it successfully. The problem usually comes down to 2 things: 1) there is a constant amount of overhead that is always needed regardless of how long you work for in a week. Meetings and collaboration to figure out what to build, discuss issues etc. if these take up 10 hours a week a full time dev has 30 hours to do other things where as a half time d…

Yeah that 2nd point is that quite often people need "full time salary" so it is not that management somehow has backwards thinking.

I have a friend that can really work 4 hours a day, but he is a special case where he does not have a family to upkeep and no mortgage. He is also a bit hard on the frugality.

But finding such person is basically 1 in a million. If I post a job with 4h a day which amounts to 1/2 of a normal salary I will probably never get a candidate. If I post a job with normal salary and then start explaining that it is 1/2 hours and accordingly paid, some people will get angry.

Re: Why not hire part-time developers?

#125

Post by gopher_space »

me_me_mu_mu wrote: post #33

Don't see this working in USA. I've never been to Europe, but work with many who are from there. You get socialized healthcare, cities with easy transit, and for the most part things are close. In the US, we don't have health insurance unless we buy it ourselves ($$$$) or our company provides it ($). We don't have easy transit in most cities, and also people do live far away from the business centers. That's why in t…

I think the US could convince non-retired people to cut back on the work week. For example, I think you could demonstrate that you need a workforce with fucked up backs alongside easy access to opioids to trigger our crisis.

Re: Why not hire part-time developers?

#126

Post by jpindar »

ozim wrote: post #124
yibg wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We’ve tried part time developers, but so far haven’t been able to do it successfully. The problem usually comes down to 2 things: 1) there is a constant amount of overhead that is always needed regardless of how long you work for in a week. Meetings and collaboration to figure out what to build, discuss issues etc. if these take up 10 hours a week a full time dev has 30 hours to do other things where as a half time d…

Yeah that 2nd point is that quite often people need "full time salary" so it is not that management somehow has backwards thinking. I have a friend that can really work 4 hours a day, but he is a special case where he does not have a family to upkeep and no mortgage. He is also a bit hard on the frugality. But finding such person is basically 1 in a million. If I post a job with 4h a day which amounts to 1/2 of a nor…

I can live quite comfortably on half a typical salary, and I'm available.

Re: Why not hire part-time developers?

#127

Post by hocuspocus »

exdsq wrote: post #109
makapuf wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I (a man) was 4/5 when my kids were small but I'm currently 9/10. Contractually it's yearly, but it ends up weekly. 9/10 tends to be difficult to distinguish from full time, since you get more focused after this mid week break.

I think if I was to go for 9/10 I’d argue for 10/10 salaries because as you mention it’s practically indistinguishable

It depends on your job and responsibilities.

I've had managers/POs/PMs/... work 90% and simply take every Friday afternoon off.

But if you're a dev then yes, taking half a day off is pretty meaningless. I see it as a way to force yourself to take 22-23 additional days of vacation, and at least two of these every month.

Re: Why not hire part-time developers?

#128

Post by prohobo »

tbrownaw wrote: post #115
prohobo wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You lost me with "extra". What I'm talking about are core product team members, not freelancers. Maybe I'm hitting on the wrong issue here, but if I was a team member coding 4 hours a day I'd be just as productive as ever. The problem I'm recognizing now is that maybe I'm really just miffed about the "butts in seats" mentality. I'd have no issue working "full-time" if that was just a way to say "team member" and didn…

> You lost me with "extra". What I'm talking about are core product team members, not freelancers. It was "extra paperwork associated with the extra staff". As in, adding X% more staff means X% more staff-related paperwork.

So don't hire so many people? I don't understand the problem. Why would they be hiring "extras" anyway? As backup?

Re: Why not hire part-time developers?

#129

Post by jokethrowaway »

Sounds like an USA issue, it's quite popular in Europe afaik.

Part time developers are generally a niche (mostly by choice, people want to get full time pay), but I know plenty of people who work 3 days per week and many more who work 4 days per week.

They mostly do it for work-life balance and to pay less taxes in some backward southern European countries where tax don't make sense (eg. in one country you can make the same money post tax whether you earn 65k or 90k, so contractors try to work up to the 65k limit and work less days).

Likewise you can find consultant roles for N days per week relatively easily.

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