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Russia to restrict Facebook access for 'censoring' its media

reuters.com

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Re: Russia to restrict Facebook access for 'censoring' its media

#191

Post by NikolaNovak »

netXten wrote: post #152
netXten wrote: post #146

Hi, Russian here, located in Moscow. I don’t root for our president and current operation in UA is not something I like. I had to say words above, sorry, and that words are true since I am mostly committed to western values. Facebook would be restricted in Russia because they don’t allow gov to publish their views, opinion and their “truth”, like any other gov can. There are also intentions to block youtube and any o…

And I forgot to ask a question. Why do you think that we all should feel pain of sanctions? Because we are not able to stand against gov? Well, we are not able. And I think noone would be able if there is such a law and permissions of authorities. And for sure we, who know English(ok, not as good like any EU-person knows) and not working in gov-structures are the most small part of russians who have different opinion

>> Why do you think that we all should feel pain of sanctions?

I feel bad for people in Russia who don't want that war either, sanctions will hurt.

But:

1. Sanctions are a way to exert pressure and say "don't DO that". They're supposed to hurt. The other effective way to send that message is to use actual force. I'm sure people of Russia would prefer that less.

2. As a kid from Sarajevo, I feel Ukrainan's pain a LOT more today than yours, because they ARE being shelled and bombed and besieged and starved. You are not. Count your lucky stars.

3. As others pointed, there are choices. At this point, mostly shitty choices, all around, for all involved. I for one ran the fuck away from that part of the world. That was a personal, selfish choice (well, in reality, made by my parents, but I sure as heck supported them). Others protest secretly. Others, braver and less selfish and more idealistic, protest loudly. Yet others take up arms. Much as Canadians let alone world like to find things to complain about US (often validly), they did hash these things in a rebellion and a Civil war and again in the violent protests of the 70's... and they seem poised to be hashing them out violently again. Point being, it's not easy ANYwhere to get things even remotely right or fair or just or peaceful. I'm not selfless enough to die fighting a government; but I recognize it is an option and a choice.

So what I'm saying is, today, people of Russia are not at top of my personal priority list of people to feel sorry for. You're not absent from it, but everything is a limited resource. Sorry :-/

Re: Russia to restrict Facebook access for 'censoring' its media

#192

Post by willcipriano »

jacquesm wrote: post #188
willcipriano wrote: post #186

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's sort of a no true scottsman. Occupy wall street resulted in nothing, BLM protests were huge to no lasting effect, massive anti war protests in the early 2000's resulted in a couple decades of war. What ones recently were big enough? Million man march? That was just LBJ buying votes if you ask him about it privately.

None of those resulted in crippling the country, which is the level you need. Without Russia propping him up Lukashenko would be out by now. Think Solidarity, not BLM and get the whole country to grind to a halt. That will make a difference. By the time the police and the army have to decide if they want to open fire on their family it can be won. But for that to happen something major will have to change in Russia f…

In Canada they just had protests that crippled the country, they just took food and the ability to bank or heat themselves from the protestors until they gave up. No change. Imagine if Trudeau had a gulag.

Re: Russia to restrict Facebook access for 'censoring' its media

#193

Post by myko »

willcipriano wrote: post #186
jacquesm wrote: post #176

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Protests work: if they are large enough.

That's sort of a no true scottsman. Occupy wall street resulted in nothing, BLM protests were huge to no lasting effect, massive anti war protests in the early 2000's resulted in a couple decades of war. What ones recently were big enough? Million man march? That was just LBJ buying votes if you ask him about it privately.

protests worked in russia in 1917

Re: Russia to restrict Facebook access for 'censoring' its media

#194

Post by 13415 »

droptablemain wrote: post #187
13415 wrote: post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The victims are the people in Ukraine, not you. People are dying there and the country has been dragged into chaos. Russia is 100% the aggressor in this case. If you don't want to feel the pain of sanctions, you better do something to change your government. This might not appear fair to you and certainly isn't easy, but don't forget that life is currently even less fair to the Ukrainians who die defending their coun…

It's not that simple. What about the 14,000 killed in the DPR and LPR over the past years?

His posts reeks of unreflected self pity and all you can offer is whataboutism?

Re: Russia to restrict Facebook access for 'censoring' its media

#195

Post by jacquesm »

willcipriano wrote: post #192
jacquesm wrote: post #188

Earlier quoted context omitted.

None of those resulted in crippling the country, which is the level you need. Without Russia propping him up Lukashenko would be out by now. Think Solidarity, not BLM and get the whole country to grind to a halt. That will make a difference. By the time the police and the army have to decide if they want to open fire on their family it can be won. But for that to happen something major will have to change in Russia f…

In Canada they just had protests that crippled the country, they just took food and the ability to bank or heat themselves from the protestors until they gave up. No change. Imagine if Trudeau had a gulag.

That was a few hundred people at best. Anyway, I can see that you believe strongly that protests don't work, I've been eyewitness to protests that did work and that changed the direction of a country (in fact, multiple countries) in a massive way.

Those instances are rare, but that's an existence proof that you can't deny (and there are, historically, more examples).

Note that the support for those Canadian protests amongst ordinary Canadians was minimal.

Re: Russia to restrict Facebook access for 'censoring' its media

#196

Post by NicoJuicy »

labster wrote: post #178
alexryndin wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> they need to start suffering You just stated that the people of the whole country need to start suffering. There already was period in our history when one politicial stated that we must all be destroyed as an ethnic group and our lands repopulated, and that was not good at all.

Ukrainians are already suffering. And Americans too will suffer from the sanctions that Americans impose. But I am willing to suffer economically to protect a free republic that truly represents its people, because they are people, just like me.

Euh... Europe is taking all the 'consequences' and economic damage from the sanctions, not the US.

Re: Russia to restrict Facebook access for 'censoring' its media

#198

Post by NoOn3 »

jacquesm wrote: post #184
NoOn3 wrote: post #180

Invasion is not a good decision. But Ukraine had some problems with radicals, with crimes and with respect to other languages in their country...

The one has absolutely nothing to do with the other, and is in part propaganda.

Ok.Maybe you're right.

Re: Russia to restrict Facebook access for 'censoring' its media

#199

Post by dragonwriter »

willcipriano wrote: post #186
jacquesm wrote: post #176

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Protests work: if they are large enough.

That's sort of a no true scottsman. Occupy wall street resulted in nothing, BLM protests were huge to no lasting effect, massive anti war protests in the early 2000's resulted in a couple decades of war. What ones recently were big enough? Million man march? That was just LBJ buying votes if you ask him about it privately.

> BLM protests were huge to no lasting effect

Accountability for criminal homicide of Black people, especially by law enforcement, has definitely increased since BLM became a force. Whether that's a lasting effect is, of course, too soon to say, but it's not to be casually dismissed as you have.

Re: Russia to restrict Facebook access for 'censoring' its media

#200

Post by LAC-Tech »

csee wrote: post #159
netXten wrote: post #146

Hi, Russian here, located in Moscow. I don’t root for our president and current operation in UA is not something I like. I had to say words above, sorry, and that words are true since I am mostly committed to western values. Facebook would be restricted in Russia because they don’t allow gov to publish their views, opinion and their “truth”, like any other gov can. There are also intentions to block youtube and any o…

Why do you use the Putin propaganda euphemism "current operation" and not just call it an invasion or war of aggression.

Because people tend to copy the terminology of the regime they live in, even if they don't agree with it.

We do the same thing. IE on English Wikipedia there's an article 2011 military intervention in Libya. I can't remember many prestigious western news sources calling it an "invasion" - so neither do most of us.

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