Show HN: Supernotes 2 – a fast, Markdown notes app for journalling and sharing • Hacker News Board

Re: Show HN: Supernotes 2 – a fast, Markdown notes app for journalling and sharing

#101

Post by dotancohen » Wed, Feb 23, 2022, 4:39 PM UTC

cercatrova wrote: post #55

yosito wrote: post #3

This app looks very nice, and I love markdown. But I am not prepared to pay £8+ per month for a Markdown notes app that works on all my devices, especially if it exerts control over what I can do with my own files. I can sync my Markdown directory via Dropbox, iCloud, Nextcloud, etc and edit the files with things like Obsidian, 1Writer, VSCode or any one of hundreds of Markdown editors.

If you'd like to sync it yourself, then by all means do so. I don't necessarily understand comments like these, if the user doesn't like it, no one is forcing them to buy it, especially if there are other solutions as you've stated.

  > I don't necessarily understand comments like these

It's called constructive criticism. The application dev is reading this forum, and will be able to see what people like and dislike about the app and the business.

Re: Show HN: Supernotes 2 – a fast, Markdown notes app for journalling and sharing

#102

Post by fastball » Wed, Feb 23, 2022, 4:40 PM UTC

interleave wrote: post #53

caslon wrote: post #4

I'm going to get ahead of the curve and warn everyone: Yes, Electron web application. Yes, noticeable input delay. Yes, memory consumption is how you might expect it to be. They distribute on Linux with an AppImage, though, which at least isn't a Snap or Flatpak, so there's that, I guess. If you want a non-proprietary Electron application, take a look at Logseq, or Athens (YC some year that I'm too lazy to look up).…

Good idea to preempt those points, keeps the conversation focused imho. One thing I noticed that I hadn't seen in any other Electron note-taking apps yet is that it's using Google Analytics to track usage but I didn't see any consent banner (?) How to poke around: cd Supernotes.app/Contents/Resources/; npx asar extract app.asar ./; cd web; cat index.html

We actually use Plausible[1] for analytics (actually switched from GA to Plausible because we much preferred their privacy story), Google Tag Manager is in there for use with Google Ads I think but honestly I'm not sure we even need that there. Thanks for pointing it out – need to double-check with my co-founder but I'm pretty certain that can be removed.

[1] https://plausible.io/

Re: Show HN: Supernotes 2 – a fast, Markdown notes app for journalling and sharing

#103

Post by tern » Wed, Feb 23, 2022, 4:41 PM UTC

throwoutway wrote: post #83

aantix wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It depends on your expectations - do you assume that the software will be maintained indefinitely with security fixes, bug fixes, features, etc?

Why can't I pay for major versions? V2, V3, V4.. if I don't want V5, fine.. I can move on

Because running multiple versions of a SaaS app is prohibitively complex.

A way to get both the advantages of SaaS and desktop + mobile apps is yet to be invented and popularized to my knowledge. The only architecture approaching this that I'm aware of is Urbit.

Re: Show HN: Supernotes 2 – a fast, Markdown notes app for journalling and sharing

#104

Post by tern » Wed, Feb 23, 2022, 4:43 PM UTC

sz4kerto wrote: post #48

aantix wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It depends on your expectations - do you assume that the software will be maintained indefinitely with security fixes, bug fixes, features, etc?

Security and bugfixes generally don't cost that much. Most of the subscription fee is going to go towards new features (and possibly new products).

And a product like this will die quickly without constant feature iteration. The space is incredibly competitive.

Re: Show HN: Supernotes 2 – a fast, Markdown notes app for journalling and sharing

#105

Post by dotancohen » Wed, Feb 23, 2022, 4:43 PM UTC

aikinai wrote: post #92

reidjs wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Neither of those apps do markdown, which I NEED, so I pay for a markdown note app

What is the advantage of Markdown over rich text without extra characters?

Markdown files can be backed up offline, version controlled with Git, grepped (in-file text search) and finded (search for filenames), parsed with awk perl or sed (yes, sorry, I've done that more often than I like to admit), edited with VIM (I live in VIM), and many other advantages.

Re: Show HN: Supernotes 2 – a fast, Markdown notes app for journalling and sharing

#106

Post by fastball » Wed, Feb 23, 2022, 4:45 PM UTC

toastercat wrote: post #31

Cenk wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just curious, do you really notice an input delay? Is there a way of measuring this? Because I tried to compare Supernotes to BBEdit and couldn’t tell the difference

Personally, I use a monitor with a 60hz refresh rate but can still tell the difference between VSCode (an Electron app) and Sublime Text for example. It's very subtle, and I overall I believe VSCode to be usable, but after enough time using a native text editor, Electron-based editors feel sluggish in comparison and it takes me a little while until I'm used to them again.

I actually used to be an avid Sublime Text coder, but at some point I switched to VSCode for other aspects of DX besides performance and my happiness with that changeover (compared to when I'd tried Atom in the past) is what convinced me that we could definitely build an Electron app that, although the perf would never be best-in-class, could definitely be good enough for 99.9% of users and use-cases.

We definitely haven't optimized quite as much as the VSCode team, but not being fully optimized means I can still improve perf for our users (myself included), which I'm always happy to do!

Re: Show HN: Supernotes 2 – a fast, Markdown notes app for journalling and sharing

#107

Post by ppeetteerr » Wed, Feb 23, 2022, 4:46 PM UTC

mbesto wrote: post #97

ppeetteerr wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would expect any software to come with security fixes, and bug fixes, even after purchase, even when I don't pay for a recurring fee.

> I would expect any software to come with security fixes, and bug fixes, even after purchase, even when I don't pay for a recurring fee. So let me get this straight. You expect to pay for anything that naturally requires maintenance just once and then expect an unlimited amount of maintenance (i.e. cost for that provider) in perpetuity? Think about that for a second and then explain to me why any business would ever…

Yes, that's how it used to work. When you bought an operating system, you received support for that product for multiple years.

Similarly, in the pre-cloud office days, you would still receive updates to your software after the purchase.

It's still the case with video games.

Re: Show HN: Supernotes 2 – a fast, Markdown notes app for journalling and sharing

#108

Post by tern » Wed, Feb 23, 2022, 4:47 PM UTC

doteka wrote: post #96

gamekathu wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because note-taking experience is subjective, and there are no solution which fits everyones taste and purpose.

That is not what I asked though. Every experience is subjective. I’m asking how they envision this being a good business model. Every bootcamp grad who can whip up a database backed web app can build a note-taking application that covers the major features. There is literally no defensible moat here and the incumbent is giving away theirs for free. What feature will you compete on? There are limits to how much innova…

I suspect it's a combination of the intense passion people feel to work on this problem and the small user-base needed to support a small team to do the work.

I'm not so good at ballparking operational expenses, but Supernotes 2 probably needs somewhere around 2000 users to break even, which probably isn't hard to achieve.

After that, the founders are fully supported to pursue their passion. Sounds like a great business model for someone who wants to do this, and I think this is why you see a profusion of utility apps with ~$10/mo pricing models on the market today.

Re: Show HN: Supernotes 2 – a fast, Markdown notes app for journalling and sharing

#109

Post by interleave » Wed, Feb 23, 2022, 4:48 PM UTC

fastball wrote: post #102

interleave wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Good idea to preempt those points, keeps the conversation focused imho. One thing I noticed that I hadn't seen in any other Electron note-taking apps yet is that it's using Google Analytics to track usage but I didn't see any consent banner (?) How to poke around: cd Supernotes.app/Contents/Resources/; npx asar extract app.asar ./; cd web; cat index.html

We actually use Plausible[1] for analytics (actually switched from GA to Plausible because we much preferred their privacy story), Google Tag Manager is in there for use with Google Ads I think but honestly I'm not sure we even need that there. Thanks for pointing it out – need to double-check with my co-founder but I'm pretty certain that can be removed. [1] https://plausible.io/

Very cool, Plausible looks like a solid alternative to GA - Thanks for pointing it out!

Re: Show HN: Supernotes 2 – a fast, Markdown notes app for journalling and sharing

#110

Post by TameAntelope » Wed, Feb 23, 2022, 4:53 PM UTC

The absolute best part of HN for me, personally, is seeing people complete/ship their projects. I am always so impressed by folks who take something in their head and turn it into a usable, shippable thing.

Very good work!