> In a Twitter thread that has been liked almost 32,000 times
Eyeroll.
In our cashless society, we need to take digital jail seriously
281–290 of 849 posts
Re: In our cashless society, we need to take digital jail seriously
#282Some seriously questionable decisions have been made by executive branches in the last few years. Just to name one other that sticks out to me, though less severe, IMO the mayor of LA should not be able to unilaterally order utilities to turn off water and power to peoples' houses.[1]
1: https://www.npr.org/sections/coronavirus-live-updates/2020/0...
Re: In our cashless society, we need to take digital jail seriously
#283Earlier quoted context omitted.
I think those things are true, and I live in Canada. I strongly support Trudeau's actions on this, and I'm sad that the government took so long to crack down on the "truckers". It's deeply damaging to civil society when a few extremists can shut down a city without consequences.
So I assume you were equally outraged not long ago at the blocking of rail lines by indigenous / environmental activists? The truckers were not violent. For real violence, look at the ax-wielding attackers in the recent incident at the gas pipeline site in BC. It is frightening how you and many other people so easily absorb state propaganda. Try thinking a bit about the circumstances here. Why did Trudeau go out of h…
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Re: In our cashless society, we need to take digital jail seriously
#284This post just seriously changed my outlook on cryptocurrencies.
Re: In our cashless society, we need to take digital jail seriously
#285Earlier quoted context omitted.
> I've never heard of any bank offering that service. I'm not a cash person, but this is literally how cash deposits work (in the US). You fill out a deposit slip with your account information, hand the slip and the cash to the teller, and that's about it. If you own checks, your check book probably came with some deposit slips pre-filled with your account information.
> this is literally how cash deposits work (in the US) I wasn't talking about cash deposits. I was talking about paying bills. I can't go to my bank and give them the account numbers of all my bills and have the bank pay them for me. If I wanted to pay each bill in cash, I would have to schlep to each individual company I pay bills to and pay them.
I'm in the US and have had checking accounts in three credit unions and five banks and they all offered this service. They don't send cash if that's what you have in mind, but they do send checks. They'll send a check to anyone given a name and address, and if I provide an account number, for many businesses they'll also receive a billing amount and pay it each month automatically.
Re: In our cashless society, we need to take digital jail seriously
#286The simple answer is to reject the cashless society. In the medium to long term it's simply incompatible with any reasonable definition of freedom. Surveillance is bad enough, but a system that allows governments to arbitrarily "turn off" thousands or millions of people at the push of a button is too powerful to not be abused. Even the mere existence of such a system has a chilling effect. Which I suspect is precisel…
This reminds me of all the posts on HN about running your own email server. Admirable but ultimately negligible.
Cryptocurrencies will provide solutions that actually scale to these problems in time, but HN’s still not ready to hear it.
Re: In our cashless society, we need to take digital jail seriously
#287The most concerning thing about Trudeau's use of the Emergencies Act is that it was both unnecessary and, despite the protests being quelled, ongoing.
First, the police in Ottawa chose not to enforce even basic laws in the area of the protest for several weeks. The result was lawlessness and a total lack of respect for the police. They were being jeered at for putting threatening flyers under windshield wipers one day, and the next they brought in armoured vehicles and riot squads. If the police had consistently written tickets and made arrests from the start of the protest it likely would not have grown as large as it did.
Presently, Trudeau is keeping the Emergencies Act in effect, not because there is an ongoing emergency, but because there might be. He's argued that some of the protesters have not left Ottawa and might return to the protest site if given the chance to do so, but there is nothing in the Emergency act that is required for the police to maintain peace and order. Trudeau wants the act to remain in effect for other reasons apparently.
The opposition is introducing a motion in parliament to end the Act, but that will likely fail unless Trudeau loses the NDP's support. However, the senate could also end the Act at any time. Given that the emergency is over they should do just that. It is entirely unclear what Trudeau hopes to accomplish by holding onto these powers.
Re: In our cashless society, we need to take digital jail seriously
#288The simple answer is to reject the cashless society. In the medium to long term it's simply incompatible with any reasonable definition of freedom. Surveillance is bad enough, but a system that allows governments to arbitrarily "turn off" thousands or millions of people at the push of a button is too powerful to not be abused. Even the mere existence of such a system has a chilling effect. Which I suspect is precisel…
"But yeah, if you want to seize assets, get a court order and go and lock someone in a box and take their things, don't take the cowardly way out and pretend that you've just flipped a database key and it's not really a big deal."
Dont worry, soon everything from your toaster to your car will be internet connected and will be disabled on command
Re: In our cashless society, we need to take digital jail seriously
#289Earlier quoted context omitted.
I think this proves GP's point. Some people are finally starting to reject the "red vs. blue" false dichotomy.
While I agree with you that we shouldn't think in 'red vs. blue' terms, the Emergencies Act was actually written because Justin Trudeau's father had undertaken even more extreme measures in the 1970s, while leader of the same party that Trudeau currently leads. This is a situation where the Liberal party has consistently taken extreme anti-civil liberties positions.
Protesters blocked multiple international borders between Canada and the US, at a cost of hundreds of millions of dollars per day ($300 million/day for the Windsor/Detroit crossing alone). There is no "civil liberty" that protects the right to blockade an international border, just as there is no civil liberty to park a convoy of trucks in someone's neighbourhood and then stay there indefinitely.
I have family who live in the Ottawa neighbourhood that went through this. They had tractor trailers parked outside their house that honked their horns all day and night for days on end. They literally had to leave and live elsewhere for almost three weeks.
I think we can agree that in a democratic society like Canada, we have civil liberties that allow us to protest, but those same liberties allow us to enjoy our homes in peace, not to mention cross international borders, subject to public health and whatever other restrictions have been put in place by our elected governments.
Re: In our cashless society, we need to take digital jail seriously
#290Earlier quoted context omitted.
Inability to pay taxes is not tax evasion, of either of the recognized types in the US (evasion of assessment, i.e., concealment of facts that would indicate tax is due, or evasion of payment, i.e., concealment of or movement out of reach of taxing authorities of funds with which taxes that are due could be paid.)
Presumably, the US government still accepts payment of taxes in cash, so that cash-based businesses that can't get a bank account can still pay. Perhaps the situation could arise in other countries though.
> Presumably, the US government still accepts payment of taxes in cash,
Not directly, though it works with partner companies that accept cash for an extra fee, with limits on per-payment and per-day payments. [0]
> so that cash-based businesses that can't get a bank account can still pay.
It would seem to be impractical for a non-trivial business to work with the cash payments limits.
[0] https://www.irs.gov/payments/pay-with-cash-at-a-retail-partn...