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Neuroscientists have recorded the activity of a dying human brain

blog.frontiersin.org

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Re: Neuroscientists have recorded the activity of a dying human brain

#131

Post by civilized »

SketchySeaBeast wrote: post #115
DanHulton wrote: post #51

There's an awful lot of uncritical supposition in this article. Sure, the brain MAY be recalling all the best moments of your life before you die, but there's zero evidence that that's what those recordings mean, aside from whimsy and hopefulness. It could just as easily be near-random memory access, similar to when we dream, and that, to me, sounds a lot more likely. I know I'm the big grumpy curmudgeon here, but I…

Yeah, I didn't see any evidence in that article that it was positive - for all we know it it's the brain serving up a collection of every time you told the waiter "you too" right after they said "enjoy your meal".

Die faster, stupid brain

Re: Neuroscientists have recorded the activity of a dying human brain

#132

Post by colordrops »

omgitsabird wrote: post #72
DonCarlitos wrote: post #8

This corresponds with what I've read previously about brain activity following clinical death. What appears to be the case is that the brain continues to work for a period after the heart stops and a last breath is taken. So what that might mean is that if one is with a person who has just died, a relative or friend, there is still a moment, just a moment, to say good bye and I love you. And it is comforting to know…

It seems strange to imagine telling someone who isn't going to experience anything ever again anything at all.

All of us will eventually never experience anything ever again. What's the difference between a few seconds and a few years.

Re: Neuroscientists have recorded the activity of a dying human brain

#133

Post by jacquesm »

jvanderbot wrote: post #128
KineticLensman wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the brain continues to work for a period after the heart stops I had a sudden cardiac arrest (Ventricular Fibrillation). I felt dizzy and oriented for a few seconds (5?) after my heart stopped pumping blood and then I passed out. There was no life-flashing-before-my-eyes, no tunnels of light, just sudden dizziness and disorientation and then nothing. The next thing I remember was coming round in hospital.

Right. I used to box and I'm now painfully aware of the fragility of consciousness. If you get hit right, the ~0.25-0.5 seconds prior and after to that hit do not exist for you. They are gone. You'll never know how you were hit or what you were doing, your eyes will just change instantly from "looking ahead" to "looking to the side/up" and you'll have to adjust very quickly to this new reality, despite the fact that…

Gmail has a little button at the bottom just after sending a mail to cancel it, that could be wired up to a boxing ball somehow.

Re: Neuroscientists have recorded the activity of a dying human brain

#134

Post by unfocussed_mike »

“Something we may learn from this research is: although our loved ones have their eyes closed and are ready to leave us to rest, their brains may be replaying some of the nicest moments they experienced in their lives.”

Or replaying their greatest embarrassments. That's what my brain will be doing -- why change the habit of a lifetime?

Re: Neuroscientists have recorded the activity of a dying human brain

#135

Post by ASalazarMX »

UltraViolence wrote: post #123

I'm very skeptical of this, mostly because there's no logical reason for this to exist. Everything in our behavior and bodies has a purpose, for the most part pure survival or reproduction. There's no use for replaying memories of one's "best moments" in life. More likely, these are random accesses of vivid memories (the ones that have been strongly imprinted on the brain) and these could be both happy or sad ones.

My mother's family has a history of seeing deceased relatives when they're about to die. It has become such tradition that some have even reported to see the dead waving and calling them to the light, but turns out they weren't at risk of death.

Autosuggestion is a powerful phenomenon. They're convinced they'll see the welcome party, and they will if their death is not sudden.

Re: Neuroscientists have recorded the activity of a dying human brain

#136

Post by hutzlibu »

DanHulton wrote: post #51

There's an awful lot of uncritical supposition in this article. Sure, the brain MAY be recalling all the best moments of your life before you die, but there's zero evidence that that's what those recordings mean, aside from whimsy and hopefulness. It could just as easily be near-random memory access, similar to when we dream, and that, to me, sounds a lot more likely. I know I'm the big grumpy curmudgeon here, but I…

"It could just as easily be near-random memory access, similar to when we dream"

Is it established that dreaming is near-random memory access? I thought the whole process of dreaming is quite far from being understood, so wouldn't it be a stretch to call it near-random, when in reality there might be pattern, but just one we do not understand yet?

Re: Neuroscientists have recorded the activity of a dying human brain

#137

Post by can16358p »

giantg2 wrote: post #3

Has there really never been anyone who died while hooked up to an EEG? That seems unlikely to me. Edit: liars liars pants on fire. It has been done before. https://www.sciencealert.com/brain-activity-recorded-as-much...

That was also my response: how, on Earth in complete history of modern medicine (or since invention of EEG), not a single death has been recorded?

I mean if I'm dying I'd like people to take an EEG recording of me to shine some light to science and neurology. It seemed super off to me in many ways... thanks for showing that it really is.

Re: Neuroscientists have recorded the activity of a dying human brain

#138

Post by can16358p »

tekni5 wrote: post #100
schodi wrote: post #22

I have that inner emotion, when thinking about death. It makes me very uneasy. When We die, if there is nothing coming, how is it to not exist? I mean, what is it like? Pure black and emptyness? I then comfort myself into thinking, in the end it comes down to energy. Like being part of that endless stream of energy that became matter and probably will return to energy somewhere in infinty. Or do we maybe just restart…

The real question for me is if consciousness is even real/physical or just an illusion. After you die time has no meaning and we don't know what happens trillions and trillions of years from that point. Maybe with limited matter or infinity, the exact universe patterns emerge once again that give you consciousness. Maybe you are reborn again in the same identical universe that contains your biological pattern, and li…

Good to see someone questioning almost exactly the same things as me.

Re: Neuroscientists have recorded the activity of a dying human brain

#139

Post by ASalazarMX »

bumby wrote: post #105
root_axis wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

imo it still doesn't seem coherent even with the "hard question" framing, the very foundation of the hard question begs us to ask why it is that subjective experience is rather than not, lacking subjective experience means we're discussing something outside the scope of the hard question, it's akin to asking "what happened before time"?

I believe Chalmers perspective is that consciousness is fundamental and irreducible. To relate it to your example, he says "Nobody tries to explain, say space or time in terms of something more basic than space or time. It's the same as mass or charge. They end up taking something as fundamental"[1] In contrast, the easy problem IS trying to explain consciousness in terms of something more fundamental, like charges o…

They suggest consciousness is fundamental and irreducible? This is like saying "where the car goes when you take all its pieces away?". Occam's razor suggests that the material (easier) explanation is much more likely to be the answer than any complex one.

It's not even a good question unless they first prove consciousness can exist outside its physical support, AKA the immortal soul.

Re: Neuroscientists have recorded the activity of a dying human brain

#140

Post by JohnBooty »

DanHulton wrote: post #51

There's an awful lot of uncritical supposition in this article. Sure, the brain MAY be recalling all the best moments of your life before you die, but there's zero evidence that that's what those recordings mean, aside from whimsy and hopefulness. It could just as easily be near-random memory access, similar to when we dream, and that, to me, sounds a lot more likely. I know I'm the big grumpy curmudgeon here, but I…

    uncritical supposition
I don't mind it because it's not masquerading as anything but supposition. Besides, this is the pop-sci summary of the actual source paper. If it's too pop-sci-ish for you, just read the actual source paper:

https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fnagi.2022.8135...

The linked paper is, of course, not necessarily super valuable from a scientific perspective. After all, n=1 and we're talking about somebody with traumatic brain injuries who has been administrated lots of psychoactive drugs. Not a typical healthy brain. But, I found it fascinating. There is some speculation but I would call it reasoned and restrained.

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