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Google Tag Manager, the new anti-adblock weapon (2020)

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Re: Google Tag Manager, the new anti-adblock weapon (2020)

#61

Post by tootie »

danhilltech wrote: post #27

Server-side tracking has been around for a while (indeed this article is dated Nov 15, 2020; and of course, you could argue simply parsing your Apache/nginx logs to get visitor stats has existed forever). The article I think conflates several different pieces. There's probably a few actual use cases marketers may care about for tagging/tracking/analytics: 1. Simplest: I want to know how many people use my site/app, h…

I think some of the whiplash in the market isn't just the tit for tat battle with ad blockers and regulators but the realization that there's so much useless data being collected. The best data we get is first party (ie things people click or type into forms on our sites) or qualitative feedback from surveys. GA and GTM are valuable tools for us but Google's network isn't really.

Re: Google Tag Manager, the new anti-adblock weapon (2020)

#62

Post by totony »

gigel82 wrote: post #48
anxrn wrote: post #39

Wouldn't it be possible for a potential client-side blocker for this to intercept the gtag() method invoked on the client side ("Tag Manager web container"), even if that function is provided by a script hosted on the website owner's domain, as Google recommends[1]? [1] https://developers.google.com/tag-platform/tag-manager/serve...

Highly doubtful the method would continue to be called "gtag"; any js bundling / minification would replace that with a randomly generated string, and it's just as easy to randomize the server-side api endpoint url, making this virtually impossible to block (maybe a pattern analysis on the data being transmitted, but that can also be encrypted with random algorithms and keys, beyond recognition).

ML is already applied to spam mail, maybe it could be applied to JS runtime behavior to detect this kind of tracking. Fight ML analytics with ML

Re: Google Tag Manager, the new anti-adblock weapon (2020)

#63

Post by heavyset_go »

gumby wrote: post #41

I am fascinated that the popular press has described this as Google adding privacy (which is how google describes it of course) where really it’s a massive escalation of their spying network.

I wouldn't be surprised if much of the popular reporting on it are just press releases.

Re: Google Tag Manager, the new anti-adblock weapon (2020)

#64

Post by jtbayly »

akkartik wrote: post #24
88913527 wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd characterize more as "Turn off JavaScript, and lose access to any site fronted by Cloudflare."

I've been running NoScript for the past year. It's pretty nice once you get to a stable set of policies. I load mainstream media sites in incognito tabs with JavaScript enabled for the tab.

So in other words you allow some of the largest, worst sites to track you. ;)

Re: Google Tag Manager, the new anti-adblock weapon (2020)

#65

Post by whalesalad »

gigel82 wrote: post #25

God damn... this is it, this is the end-game. There's no way to fight this unless you customize and maintain blocking scripts for each individual website. Yes, websites could always have done this, but the REST (CDN-bypassing) requests' cost and the manual maintenance for the telemetry endpoints and storage was an impediment that Google just gives them a drop-in solution for :( I think Google is happy to eat some of…

Just block Google tag manager itself. Gets two birds stoned at the same time.

Re: Google Tag Manager, the new anti-adblock weapon (2020)

#66

Post by PeterisP »

That's why we need generic legislation without consideration of specific technologies, restricting the general goals, not just one particular way to achieve them. GDPR would forbid this tracking without opt-in consent - the fact that you have the technical ability to effectively handle tracking information server-side without support from the user/browser (as for cookies) does not imply that you have the right to do so.

We don't have to win a technical fight, we have to ensure that privacy-invasive tracking is not profitable because all the major legitimate megacorp advertisers throwing billions at internet ads are prohibited from using that.

Re: Google Tag Manager, the new anti-adblock weapon (2020)

#67

Post by chrisseaton »

whalesalad wrote: post #65
gigel82 wrote: post #25

God damn... this is it, this is the end-game. There's no way to fight this unless you customize and maintain blocking scripts for each individual website. Yes, websites could always have done this, but the REST (CDN-bypassing) requests' cost and the manual maintenance for the telemetry endpoints and storage was an impediment that Google just gives them a drop-in solution for :( I think Google is happy to eat some of…

Just block Google tag manager itself. Gets two birds stoned at the same time.

How would you do that? Isn't it the server that talks to Google Tag Manager, not the browser?

Re: Google Tag Manager, the new anti-adblock weapon (2020)

#68

Post by booleandilemma »

gigel82 wrote: post #25

God damn... this is it, this is the end-game. There's no way to fight this unless you customize and maintain blocking scripts for each individual website. Yes, websites could always have done this, but the REST (CDN-bypassing) requests' cost and the manual maintenance for the telemetry endpoints and storage was an impediment that Google just gives them a drop-in solution for :( I think Google is happy to eat some of…

Simpler protocols (Gemini, Gopher...), outright refusing to use what the modern web has become. I only use HN and a few select sites. You don't need an ad-blocker if there are no ads in the first place.

Re: Google Tag Manager, the new anti-adblock weapon (2020)

#69

Post by akkartik »

jtbayly wrote: post #64
akkartik wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've been running NoScript for the past year. It's pretty nice once you get to a stable set of policies. I load mainstream media sites in incognito tabs with JavaScript enabled for the tab.

So in other words you allow some of the largest, worst sites to track you. ;)

Elaborate? I have dnt turned on and am using incognito tabs? Still not good enough?
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