Live data from Hacker News

Can Slack-mania be cured with systemized discipline?

brandur.org

81–90 of 205 posts

Re: Can Slack-mania be cured with systemized discipline?

#81

> For the next five years I operated in “Slack culture”, the communication paradigm that I suspect is in use by many companies these days. Email inboxes were more or less reserved for broadcasts from exec and HR along with JIRA spam. Everything else happens on Slack. This is the real problem, IMO. Slack shouldn't be replacing e-mail or meetings or phone calls. It's great for impromptu discussions with a lot of back-a…

> Casual, asynchronous chat is great ... I'm in the lead-weight-dragging tail (working in a bank using Teams, but dealt with this at the last job in Slack as well). The major hassle seems to be getting people to understand this is asynchronous communication (perpetrators are both developers and executives) and this problem seems to stand before the rest of the more sophisticated complaints evinced here can be even ad…

Yes, I see this problem as well. People need to be told that they don't need to ask if you can ask... just ask.

Re: Can Slack-mania be cured with systemized discipline?

#82

To me, it is incredible that Slack is used WITHOUT threads. There is no way that information and discussions can be effective without a threaded conversation - it would just be pure cause otherwise. Also, I find feature-specific channels to be such a pleasure. It's easy to have everyone focused on the same topic in a given channel, without any confusion or missing information between different channels or private mes…

What are "no-focus times"?

Some companies these days have so many interruptions (often in the form of Zoom meetings) that you need to dedicate "focus time" to get any actual work done.

Re: Can Slack-mania be cured with systemized discipline?

#84

> For the next five years I operated in “Slack culture”, the communication paradigm that I suspect is in use by many companies these days. Email inboxes were more or less reserved for broadcasts from exec and HR along with JIRA spam. Everything else happens on Slack. This is the real problem, IMO. Slack shouldn't be replacing e-mail or meetings or phone calls. It's great for impromptu discussions with a lot of back-a…

This behavior is caused by the presence indicator. People subsconsiously are afraid that closing Slack will signal to their boss (and team) that they're not working. However, the result is that they spend their days slacking - not working.

Presence indicators are a dark pattern.

Re: Can Slack-mania be cured with systemized discipline?

#85
post #69

no. Slack sucks and I don't think companies realize just how much time and energy it wastes. I am lucky if I can get one day of focused programming in anymore. Most days I am exhausted from constant interrupts and when I finally do get time at the end of the day I am completely spent. Everyone needs a personal guide through AWS/K8s/Infra Tool when about 50% of the time we have internal documentation answering the que…

People will always prefer asking, as that comes with a built-in lookup table and related links and probably up-to-date information. It's just easier than to spend time sifting through documentation that may or may not have the information they seek.

Don't blame the medium.

Instead, change your response so that they stop expecting your time.

Re: Can Slack-mania be cured with systemized discipline?

#86

I'm tired of constant chatting. Slack encourages quick, stream-of-consciousness, short responses. Plus, it's hard to find past discussion, and it's hard to jump in after being gone for a few days (or, even a few hours). Threads are absolutely the answer. But, the defaults matter - Slack isn't encouraging threaded, long-form messages. Instead, it makes all messages feel urgent - and it makes the cost of sending a mess…

My friend works at a company that -- on orders from legal -- has set a 5-day "disappearing messages" policy for all of the corp Slack. Unfortunately nearly all technical discussions happen on Slack. He tells me that it's not unusual for messages to start disappearing before the issue being worked on has even been resolved, and everyone has to re-ask the same questions and re-post the answers at that point, and someti…

I was at a similar company. It's a bad sign when companies prioritize hiding errors over enabling success.

Re: Can Slack-mania be cured with systemized discipline?

#87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My friend works at a company that -- on orders from legal -- has set a 5-day "disappearing messages" policy for all of the corp Slack. Unfortunately nearly all technical discussions happen on Slack. He tells me that it's not unusual for messages to start disappearing before the issue being worked on has even been resolved, and everyone has to re-ask the same questions and re-post the answers at that point, and someti…

Has legal decreed you can't have a wiki as well?

I would guess that since wiki is less of an impulsive stream-of-consciousness type of a medium and more of a "sit down and write things in an organized manner after thinking things through" type, people are much less likely to put something that could create a problem for legal there (as opposed to Slack).

Not sure how factually true this is, but that rationale makes perfect sense in my head for why legal would make that rule for Slack/messaging while being totally cool with persistent wikis.

Re: Can Slack-mania be cured with systemized discipline?

#88
post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Casual, asynchronous chat is great ... I'm in the lead-weight-dragging tail (working in a bank using Teams, but dealt with this at the last job in Slack as well). The major hassle seems to be getting people to understand this is asynchronous communication (perpetrators are both developers and executives) and this problem seems to stand before the rest of the more sophisticated complaints evinced here can be even ad…

We have an unofficial policy in my company that all pertinent information should be in the first message specifically to avoid the scenario you mention. Highly recommended.

Can you shed light on how this consciousness was raised? I'm the sort who demurs to be his own cause.

edit: this is evidence (for me) of why UX is B.S. completely detached from HCI.

Re: Can Slack-mania be cured with systemized discipline?

#89

I'm tired of constant chatting. Slack encourages quick, stream-of-consciousness, short responses. Plus, it's hard to find past discussion, and it's hard to jump in after being gone for a few days (or, even a few hours). Threads are absolutely the answer. But, the defaults matter - Slack isn't encouraging threaded, long-form messages. Instead, it makes all messages feel urgent - and it makes the cost of sending a mess…

It sounds like what should be brought back is NNTP or mailing list.

Re: Can Slack-mania be cured with systemized discipline?

#90

I'm tired of constant chatting. Slack encourages quick, stream-of-consciousness, short responses. Plus, it's hard to find past discussion, and it's hard to jump in after being gone for a few days (or, even a few hours). Threads are absolutely the answer. But, the defaults matter - Slack isn't encouraging threaded, long-form messages. Instead, it makes all messages feel urgent - and it makes the cost of sending a mess…

My friend works at a company that -- on orders from legal -- has set a 5-day "disappearing messages" policy for all of the corp Slack. Unfortunately nearly all technical discussions happen on Slack. He tells me that it's not unusual for messages to start disappearing before the issue being worked on has even been resolved, and everyone has to re-ask the same questions and re-post the answers at that point, and someti…

I'm struggle to understand a situation where that would ever be justifiable.

If they have a good reason for deleting messages, that's bad. If their legal team is overzealous and that power is unchecked, that's also bad.

Post reply on HN