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Pedestrian deaths spike in U.S. as reckless driving surges

nytimes.com

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Re: Pedestrian deaths spike in U.S. as reckless driving surges

#261

Post by mistersquid »

chiefalchemist wrote: post #244
mistersquid wrote: post #235

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The point being, when possible, you should walk facing into traffic. Please do not recommend this reckless and often illegal behavior. If walking in the street, one should walk with traffic when possible. Drivers and other forms of traffic merging into traffic do not expect pedestrian traffic coming from the wrong direction. Salmoning causes other dangers, too, for example, by making it difficult to impossible for…

Given the number off people who text while driving, I'd say you're far more likely to get hit from behind than you woukd while walking into traffic.

This seems odd to me because a pedestrian is almost never going to be able to dodge oncoming even slow-moving traffic.

Perhaps it’s about observing inattentive drivers before they present immediate danger or establishing eye contact?

In any case, I stand corrected on the legality of pedestrian salmoning, though I’m not convinced of its advisability.

Re: Pedestrian deaths spike in U.S. as reckless driving surges

#262

Post by throwaway0a5e »

JKCalhoun wrote: post #203
bitexploder wrote: post #176

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I drove a 1990 Mustang V8 from ‘00-06 or so. It was 0-60 in about 6-flat. So that is a good reference point. Our 4Runner also makes 300hp and is actually sluggish, even by older standards. So not all cars are insane and it is really nice to have efficient 300hp engines for a lot of reasons. My truck makes 500hp and 1000 ft/lbs torque and gets like 18-19 mpg in its stock form. Extremely useful for towing and amazing e…

Anecdotally, when going on walks in my neighborhood, the cars with massive fender damage in the driveways are the modern "muscle cars": the Dodge Charger, new Ford Mustangs.... Are car manufacturers, knowingly or not, selling a reckless lifestyle?

The demographics that buy cars that are high on the performance per dollar spectrum are the same demographics who are going to think twice before or at least delay spending money to fix cosmetic body issues.

Re: Pedestrian deaths spike in U.S. as reckless driving surges

#263

Post by P_I_Staker »

samwillis wrote: post #34

Here in the UK they have just changed the Highway Code (the rules that given all road users, including pedestrians) so that pedestrians have ultimate right of way in almost all cases. It’s the opposite of the situation in the US, a pedestrian in the UK can cross the road anywhere and I believe cars have to stop and make way. It’s going to be interesting to see how it effects accident numbers, I’m worry it may actuall…

Generally, pedestrians have right of way, is what I was taught in the USA.

Re: Pedestrian deaths spike in U.S. as reckless driving surges

#264

Post by ghaff »

masklinn wrote: post #105
Aeolun wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We used to have lovely speedbumps every 50 meters or so in our neighborhood. Can’t drive fast if it’ll make your car fly.

Such active traffic calming measures can be combined with more passive ones (lane narrowing, visual obstructions) to create a psychological slowdown effect in addition to the physical ones. This works especially well combined with pedestrian and cycle passthroughs and such, including to avoid “drive-through” neighbourhoods without having to make the neighbourhood entirely impassable and a pain in the ass to residents…

>including to avoid “drive-through” neighbourhoods without having to make the neighbourhood entirely impassable and a pain in the ass to residents.

I suspect that Google Maps and the like have worsened the level of driving through residential neighborhoods as they route you through a maze of residential streets to save (in theory) two minutes.

Re: Pedestrian deaths spike in U.S. as reckless driving surges

#265

Post by paulcole »

collegeburner wrote: post #88
efitz wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How exactly did you get to “the cause of reckless driving is fat people who don’t walk everywhere?” Show your work. In most places in America walking is not a practical mode of transportation because of distance; it’s miles from your house to the grocery store, for instance. If you live in a city this might not be obvious to you but half the country lives in the burbs or rural areas. Separately, it would be nice if w…

It's also temperature. I'm not walking in 100 degrees, even 3 blocks because I'm soaked when I get there and stink.

Get there earlier and relax in the AC? Bring a change of clothes and a stick of deodorant? Cool off with water and baby wipes in the bathroom? Deal with being sweaty and smelly.

Whether that is worth it or not to you is up to you to decide. But you've just found another excuse for driving when walking is possible (not possible for everyone, but possible for some).

Re: Pedestrian deaths spike in U.S. as reckless driving surges

#266

Post by giantg2 »

JKCalhoun wrote: post #203
bitexploder wrote: post #176

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I drove a 1990 Mustang V8 from ‘00-06 or so. It was 0-60 in about 6-flat. So that is a good reference point. Our 4Runner also makes 300hp and is actually sluggish, even by older standards. So not all cars are insane and it is really nice to have efficient 300hp engines for a lot of reasons. My truck makes 500hp and 1000 ft/lbs torque and gets like 18-19 mpg in its stock form. Extremely useful for towing and amazing e…

Anecdotally, when going on walks in my neighborhood, the cars with massive fender damage in the driveways are the modern "muscle cars": the Dodge Charger, new Ford Mustangs.... Are car manufacturers, knowingly or not, selling a reckless lifestyle?

My anecdotal evidence shows it being mostly small cars like civics, darts, etc that have the fender damage. Most of the muscle cars I see are very well taken care of. Also, when I used to drive a muscle car, the people acting like idiots wanting to road race were always in small stuff like an RSX, Golf, etc.

Most car guys love their cars and are well aware of the power and dynamics that can destroy it (or have it seized). But that's just my experience.

"Are car manufacturers, knowingly or not, selling a reckless lifestyle?"

If they are, it's across the board. Any vehicle can be dangerous - civics, F150s, mustangs, minivans, etc. Many people don't understand vehicle limits, dynamics, and their own limitations. A lot of this is because people have rarely experienced situations that would require, for lack of a better word, extreme actions. Things like autocross can give people some understanding of these, provided they aren't the personality that would use it to create false confidence.

Re: Pedestrian deaths spike in U.S. as reckless driving surges

#267

Post by ericmay »

syshum wrote: post #256
ericmay wrote: post #177

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Honestly if city employed people to remove the snow from the sidewalks and sent me a bill like they do trash collection I would have less of a problem with them. That is not what they do though... I'm not kidding - the other day some kids walked by and asked if they could shovel my sidewalk and driveway before I got the chance to do it myself and I just paid them to do it. How cool is that? Why do you need the city…

Because not everyone has neighborhoods of kids offering to shovel snow, I even tried to contract it out however most of the companies around here want commercial contracts not residential snow removal, and the ones that do offer "best effort" time tables where their commercial customers come first. The last home I had with sidewalks the city would fine you if they were not cleared in 24 hours, contractors would come…

Ah crap didn't realize I was dealing with a COVID denier. Nothing more to say here.

Re: Pedestrian deaths spike in U.S. as reckless driving surges

#268

Post by dncornholio »

dqv wrote: post #251
dncornholio wrote: post #183

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because pedestrians have the intrinsic motivation of not wanting to die. This question baffles me because where I'm from, hitting a pedestrian or biker with your car, the car driver is almost always 100% liable. And it works. Cars don't want to hit cyclists or pedestrians because they don't want to pay, and cyclists/pedestrians don't want to hit cars because they want to stay alive.

>Because pedestrians have the intrinsic motivation of not wanting to die. Do they? Where I live, at night, no one ever wears reflectors, save a few cyclists. It seems like people don’t think about this at all. You’re walking around at night and someone driving a car doesn’t see you until it’s too late. I think there is some merit to asking the question about how pedestrians can be safer. I’m happy to practice what I…

Where are you walking around where a car might hit you though? Are there no sidewalks?

Infrastructure needs to be build around pedestrians and cyclists. The youtube channel "Not Just Bikes" shows how it can be done.

Re: Pedestrian deaths spike in U.S. as reckless driving surges

#269

Post by P_I_Staker »

shkkmo wrote: post #208
dazc wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In my experience, if you are in the road then, in the mind of the driver, you should not be there and there are various ways in which they will demonstrate this to you. Ranging from an angry face, at one end of the spectrum, to purposely accelerating towards you, at the other. So, yes, I think you're right, casualties are more likely to increase since few drivers are going to be changing their behaviour any time soon…

I've been yelled multiple times this last year for crossing the road...at a stop light when I had a "walk" light. I always treat cars as if they are trying to kill me, but the levels of callous disregard for the safety and wellbeing of other road users seems like it has reached new highs. I think we need to get much more proactive about revoking licenses. I am also heavily considering getting a dashcam to start recor…

As much as I understand that sentiment. I don't think license restrictions are a very good idea, except in really egregious cases. It would be nice to see in really extreme cases where pedestrians / bikers are disregarded in a really callous manor, but unfortunately I'm not sure the police see many clearcut cases of this.

Taking away licenses is not a clean and easy thing in the US, because you basically make someone the ward of someone else, or an outlaw. People can't get by without vehicles, and much of the time they just have to risk it. Best case scenario someone else has to babysit them.

I definitely agree we need to make it easier for people to get by without their cars. I just can't stomach making people second class citizens, which is what these laws do. I'm only in favor of them in really egregious, repeat violation situations. Like people that refuse to stop drinking and driving; the ones that just keep doing it over and over. Even then, I'm willing to talk about options in the grand scheme of things like ignition interlock systems (actually not even available to many repeat offenders in my state)

Re: Pedestrian deaths spike in U.S. as reckless driving surges

#270

Post by dncornholio »

CalRobert wrote: post #136

Drivers are the leading cause of dead kids. But for some reason we completely ignore it, while focusing on gun violence (which is also bad, to be clear). I really don't know a solution aside from moving to a country that's better designed. The US seems too far gone. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ul_xzyCDT98

Funny thing is, The Netherlands used to have infra that looked more like the US once, but we almost completely rebuild all the infrastructure in our towns and cities during the 80's. It's not too late, it 'just' needs a lot of investment. The biggest problem is US culture around cars and mobility IMO. Better public transport is a nice start.
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