Earlier quoted context omitted.
Along with the bounty for this one: https://gerhard-wagner.medium.com/double-spending-bug-in-pol... (also $2M [1]) [1] https://portswigger.net/daily-swig/polygon-pays-out-record-2...
Ah, but, you see: this bounty was $2M...+42! (omg; I honestly hadn't noticed this o_O)
Attacking an Ethereum L2 with Unbridled Optimism
91–100 of 156 posts
Re: Attacking an Ethereum L2 with Unbridled Optimism
#92Earlier quoted context omitted.
That's not even the most fundamental issue with LN though, it's not a fully thought out system. As LN node count increases the routing complexity increases exponentially, which is the classic problem of routing issues on large graphs that literally every networked system has. The internet solves this with some degree of human intervention to tip the scales to particular routes, which is something that the LN inherent…
The main issue with LN is even more fundamental than that. Their argument against other scaling solutions was basically "if we scale on chain the hardware requirements will be hard for regular people to keep up and decentralization will suffer". So instead they went about and created a system where only the wealthy have the capital to commit to open enough channels and route payments. LN is almost totally antithetica…
Now that people are starting to realize what bitcoin actually is, and all the lies and misinformation are falling away, the world is gearing up to pounce on it and fully integrate it into society. People are rapidly realizing that it really is the internet of money.
Monero will still have it's place, but only as the dark money network.
I've actually become increasingly worried that Monero is at pretty significant risk of a nation state 51% mining attack, since it mines with generic CPUs. A government could rent out an AWS fleet to attack the network and if not kill it, at least add a lot of friction via this kind of DDOSing that temporarily blocks people and breaks interest, like they do with Tor services today.
Re: Attacking an Ethereum L2 with Unbridled Optimism
#93Earlier quoted context omitted.
>While we did our best to communicate this months in advance on our twitter, blog, discord, and documentation, it's hard to reach everyone and we totally agree that this is not ideal That doesn't look like your best. Here's the blog you refer to[1]: https://optimismpbc.medium.com/ Imagine I came to it around the time of the switchover. Which of those headlines looks like it's alerting me that my transaction history w…
You're right that we could have been better communicators about this. We prioritized our concerns with applications that could break during the upgrade, and we biased our public communications towards developers as a result. For example, you're right that a notification on our homepage, in addition to our docs, would have been a good reminder to users. We'll work on getting a blog post and better documentation up tha…
I don't remember it being in the docs either, as that would have also saved me from signing up on the Discord.
And this isn't an issue of prioritization. Remember, your overworked volunteers and maintainers on the Discord are still spending hours every day fielding questions in #user-support that could have been answered by a link in prominent places. You're wasting more person-hours than you would have with effective communication and trivial updates in prominent places.
You didn't even benefit your own goals by leaving those out!
So no, I guess I don't understand what the huge barrier is to putting out these important notices.
Re: Attacking an Ethereum L2 with Unbridled Optimism
#94Earlier quoted context omitted.
Hasn't time already proven the skeptics right? The biggest sources of skeptism were around logistics and value as a currency: Is there a cryptocoin that has successfully solved logistics without disastrously failing as a currency? Even if you ignore the environmental aspect... has any coin that has achieved scale not experienced deflation that would make the Great Depression look like a hiccup? To me the skepticism h…
Has it? Bitcoin is bigger than ever before. It's far more valuable, it has far more users, processes hundreds of thousands of transactions moving billions of dollars worth of value every day on-chain alone, has very healthy L2 layer growth (1ml.com), has hundreds of exchanges worldwide, it ticks every 10 minutes and will keep ticking for the foreseeable future. We have a small country that adopted it as a legal tende…
You know, the whole "relatively stable store of value paying for productive output rather than speculation and fraud?"
We moved off the gold standard for a reason (and it's not all geopolitics...)
Re: Attacking an Ethereum L2 with Unbridled Optimism
#95Earlier quoted context omitted.
Ethereum didn't start that way, it had to build trust over time just like any other project. Eventually L2s will get there too.
Same with Polygon their Ethereum L2+Sidechaining scaling solutions. Polygon is quickly building a reputation for solid secure code, mostly because their team kicks ass and is proactive.
Re: Attacking an Ethereum L2 with Unbridled Optimism
#96This title is way underselling this. As far as I could gather from a quick googling, this is the largest single bug bounty payout in history.
Re: Attacking an Ethereum L2 with Unbridled Optimism
#97Earlier quoted context omitted.
Security of zk rollups may be sufficient for a lot of activity - trading, DeFi, games, art, DAO/access tokens, escrow, crowdfunds, all the web3 stuff. The L1 may eventually be a primary settlement layer for protocols like zkSync and StarkNet (and any other protocols and rollups built on Ethereum L1). At some point it may not be common for users to interact with L1—ie. users of Argent and Sequence wallets may only be…
I gotta admit I don't know what 50% of the words there mean, but it surprises me to suggest that "absolute integrity" would not be required for trading, escrow, DeFi, DAO/access tokens. Makes sense for games and art (but then I wonder what they are doing using a blockchain in the first place).
The trade-off is basically scalability (and thus fees). If the L1 network is so highly congested that each transaction costs $100 or more in the future, a scalable zk rollup that achieves about the same level of security at the cost of [1] - https://zksync.io/userdocs/security.html#security-overview
Re: Attacking an Ethereum L2 with Unbridled Optimism
#98Earlier quoted context omitted.
Most end-users won't be acting as payment gateways, they'll all have private channels, so they won't appear in the routing graphs. The number of routing nodes would be many magnitude smaller than total number of LN users. It's working fine for now with growing adoption (1ml.com) and I believe it'll only get better with time.
Unless things have changed recently the big issue with LN is that it's fundamentally a centralizing force. The idea that everybody is going to open a million channels with every single counterparty (locking coins in the process) is ridiculous. Instead people would just open a couple of channels with big, centralized nodes but that's just Visa with cryptobabble on top.
Even if everyone had channels with the same, single central node it would have more guarantees than Visa does. The single central node could not just decide to keep everyone's money, as participants have the option to create an L1 transaction to withdraw funds if node they have a channel with misbehaves.
Re: Attacking an Ethereum L2 with Unbridled Optimism
#99Can someone explain this to me? He states that Optimism doesn’t have a native gas token and native currency, and eth balances are implemented using ERC20 tokens with OVM instead of the native balance mechanism However the exploit is using selfdestruct to transfer and create the remaining balance to the target address, effectively creating new tokens out of thin air. > This means that, when a contract self-destructs,…
Re: Attacking an Ethereum L2 with Unbridled Optimism
#100Earlier quoted context omitted.
That's an issue with all cryptocurrency infrastructure though: projects need to be proven to demonstrate robust value and it's probably one of the most adversarial spaces in software. History has shown that hacks and exploits of projects hurt the price of the native taken but do not really damage the long-term earned trust.
Exactly this, it's a very adversarial environment with huge stakes for those that can exploit it. Even projects that have been around for months, years can get exploited which is why I'd recommend waiting a long time before putting non-trivial amounts into any smart contract or crypto related projects. That's also a big plus for Bitcoin, because it's been around the longest and because it's so much simpler than more…
I’ve always understood this on a basic level, but reading an entire exploit debrief with intricate technical details really hammered this point home for me.