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Every employee who leaves Apple becomes an ‘associate’

washingtonpost.com

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Re: Every employee who leaves Apple becomes an ‘associate’

#11

Post by progforlyfe »

Maxburn wrote: post #5
tablespoon wrote: post #3

> Apple offers a phone number employers can call to verify titles of former Apple employees. A voice recording on that line directs callers to the web site for InVerify, an employment verification service provider owned by credit agency Equifax. When The Washington Post called InVerify’s customer support number, a customer service representative said Apple is the only company he knew of that changes job titles of emp…

I can't think of a legitimate reason for it other than to create problems for people that leave Apple. That practice sounds pretty dirty.

Why would anyone worthy ever leave Apple? Such a thing would be so... unclean.

Re: Every employee who leaves Apple becomes an ‘associate’

#12

Post by runnerup »

furyg3 wrote: post #9
dncornholio wrote: post #4

There's databases out there with everyone's career record where you have no control over but the employers do? I rest my case..

Wait, can a future employer request my past salary information from InVerify (or another service) without my approval or permission?

Yes: https://theworknumber.com There's currently no legal constraint on the use/sale of this privately-held/privately-sold data.

The background-check forms you sign are not for this, they're primarily for legal permission to check your credit history.

Re: Every employee who leaves Apple becomes an ‘associate’

#13

Post by NazakiAid »

_fat_santa wrote: post #6

Wouldn't there be other ways for you to prove you were a "Level 4" or whatever at Apple and not an associate? An offer letter from Apple? Or just the totality of circumstances in general. If say you're interviewing for a "Sr Engineer" position, you're just not going to have an instance where the candidate shows experience and knowledge but doesn't get hired because some record from Lexis Nexis says that he was an "as…

Maybe covered by NDA or could be forged?

I don't know how it works if you accept the NDA and get promoted within.

Re: Every employee who leaves Apple becomes an ‘associate’

#14

Post by thomascgalvin »

furyg3 wrote: post #9
dncornholio wrote: post #4

There's databases out there with everyone's career record where you have no control over but the employers do? I rest my case..

Wait, can a future employer request my past salary information from InVerify (or another service) without my approval or permission?

I don't know about InVerify specifically, but yes, this is a thing companies do.

Re: Every employee who leaves Apple becomes an ‘associate’

#16

Post by gwbas1c »

I remember when I interned at Intel, on the way out I asked about references and I was told, very nicely, that Intel's official policy is to only confirm employment.

I suspect that this is really what Apple is doing; but that some accident of circumstance required them to provide a very generic title. Perhaps they can't confirm employment without some kind of title, and that title's now been twisted out of context?

FYI: The practice mildly makes sense. Many employment issues are highly subjective, so a large company might decide that saying anything about a former employee is a liability, so they'll only say the minimal possible facts: "Yes, X is a former employee from [date range.]" Or, "No, X never worked for us."

Re: Every employee who leaves Apple becomes an ‘associate’

#17

Post by stuff4ben »

piva00 wrote: post #8

It surprised me much more to know that there are databases maintained by the likes of Equifax about persons' complete employment history, job titles and all... I think GDPR here in Europe really woke up the feeling that this kind of data shouldn't exist without explicit approval from the person which PII belongs to. This is beyond fucked up in my data privacy minded worldview.

Exactly right! There is PII data out there that refers to us but we can't access and can't correct and can't deny the use of to others. This seems like a pretty big privacy thing that needs to be corrected.

Re: Every employee who leaves Apple becomes an ‘associate’

#18

Post by tedivm »

I think it's really important to note that Apple does not have to share their database with these third party companies, but not only do they choose to do so they also make sure the information is wrong. Apple is, essentially, being unethical on two levels. They're selling or sharing employee information, and they're purposefully making it so that information is wrong.

I want to stress this- I ask during the interview process of every company I work at whether they share employment information with the credit bureaus and most say no. I've worked at startups and a couple of larger companies. What Apple is doing here seems purely vindictive.

I'm also not sure how this is legal- it seems like it would fall under defamation laws. I would personally be willing to sue over this (but I've never worked for Apple).

Re: Every employee who leaves Apple becomes an ‘associate’

#19

Post by manuelabeledo »

gwbas1c wrote: post #16

I remember when I interned at Intel, on the way out I asked about references and I was told, very nicely, that Intel's official policy is to only confirm employment. I suspect that this is really what Apple is doing; but that some accident of circumstance required them to provide a very generic title. Perhaps they can't confirm employment without some kind of title, and that title's now been twisted out of context? F…

Title is nothing subjective. In fact, titles and levels can be matched between two companies easily.

Anyway, this is not what Apple is doing. They are downgrading everyone by default, which is akin to providing false information about a former employee.

Re: Every employee who leaves Apple becomes an ‘associate’

#20

Post by trenning »

Sounds like when you leave Apple you are free to give yourself a title promotion since they wipe all that info.

I would also pass on any company that needs references to my job title because their dystopian background check through the infamous Equifax says I'm an associate, even with a software engineering background, haha that part was beyond silly.

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