Live data from Hacker News

AlphaCode as a dog speaking mediocre English

scottaaronson.blog

151–160 of 263 posts

Re: AlphaCode as a dog speaking mediocre English

#151

Why do we write code ? Code is not a goal. It's a tool. The tool can get better. But it will always be a tool and someone has to control the tool. Writing code is super easy. It's the easiest part of our job. The hard part of our jobs is to understand why we need to write code and right along that, what we write code for ? Maintenance Structuring Domain knowledge Refactoring Those are hard things to do. And they are…

[deleted]

Re: AlphaCode as a dog speaking mediocre English

#152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mostly work with data mining on my personal projects(which is a couple of hours every day), and I'm pretty sure I didn't have to write a single regex since I've started using Copilot. It's hard for me to even imagine how I used to do it before, and how much time I've wasted on stupid mistakes and typos. Now I just write a comment of what I want and an example string. It does the job without me having to modify anyt…

How do you know the regular expressions are correct, without understanding them?

Who cares if they're correct? If they fail a test, you can fix them. If they turn out to be wrong in production you can isolate the example and add it as a test. Producing regexes that pass all current tests but contain a subtle bug satisfy 100% of what programmers are incentivized to do. Producing them very quickly will get you promoted.

Re: AlphaCode as a dog speaking mediocre English

#153
post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>ventriloquist trick I don't understand your analogy here. It really is the machine talking; there is no human hiding behind the curtain.

I think better analogy is parrot speaking English. Certainly no ventriloquism there.

This metaphor doesn't do justice to parrots or language models. Parrots only speak a phrase or two. LMs can write full essays.

On the other hand parrots can act in the environment, LMs are isolated from the world and society. So a parrot has a chance to test its ideas out, but LMs don't.

Re: AlphaCode as a dog speaking mediocre English

#154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It does write its own tests, i.e. to the extent it checks the generated programs work on the data provided and discards the ones that don't. I imagine many of the coding challenges it's trained on come with a few tests as well.

I meant actually coming up with examples consisting of specific problems and their correct solutions (and maybe some counterexamples.) Ironically, I had just replaced 'test cases' with 'tests', because I thought that the former might seem too generic, and arguably satisfiable merely by rephrasing the problem statement as a test case to be satisfied.

That would imply the AI already solved the problem, as it needs the solution inorder to generate tests, e.g. An AI can't test addition without being able to add, and so on

Re: AlphaCode as a dog speaking mediocre English

#155
post #9

It would be interesting to know how much of this improvement in the last 25 since he was a student comes from Moore's law, other hardware improvements, various new technologies not related to AI, amount of money being thrown at the problem... and how much of it are advancements in our understanding of AI.

It’s mostly Moores law and scaling. Language model progress will be the next Moores law until diminishing returns are reached.

A recent paper shows that empowering a language model to search a text corpus (or the internet) for additional information could improve model efficiency by 25 times [1]. So you only need a small model because you can consult the text to get trivia.

That's 25x in one go. Maybe we have the chance to run GPT-4 ourselves and not need 20 GPU cards and a 1mil $ computer.

[1] https://deepmind.com/research/publications/2021/improving-la...

Re: AlphaCode as a dog speaking mediocre English

#156
post #97

Which rate of progress are we ITT expecting from alphacode-like models? In another thread I predicted we’d see competitive programming “solved” in ten years or less. I didn’t rigorously explain what I meant by that in that thread, so I’ll clarify what I meant. I expect AI to beat humans at competitive programming at the same rate as AlphaGo beats human Go players. There could be diminshing returns soon but I don’t se…

I am willing take on your bet, as long you agree with my condition...you can't feed it with any of the millions of lines of code previously created by humans you aim to beat...;-)

How would the AI learn then? Humans learn by looking at existing code and gleaning new ideas, and does the AI although it requires much more data.

Give the AI as much data as it wants, if it manages to solve something, it means it's a problem worth automating (is this a cat?)

Re: AlphaCode as a dog speaking mediocre English

#158
post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If a junior dev writes truly head-scratching code, you could ping that person and ask why they wrote this line a certain way, as opposed to a more straight-forward way. Correct me if I'm wrong but you can't ask an ML model to do that (yet).

True. But is it really important "why"? I think what's more important is whether we can correct AI's output in a way that makes it learn to avoid writing similar head-scratching code in the future.

Unless the AI can fix the bug itself, a human is going to have to explore the AI-generated code. The AI cannot help you here and you are going to have to figure out the "why" all by yourself. It will become incredibly easy to generate code with prompts but fixing any problem is going to be a pain. The "Tech Debt" would be astronomical.

Re: AlphaCode as a dog speaking mediocre English

#159
post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Compilers didn't replace any jobs, they created more. Similarly, this type of AI-assisted programming will allow more people to program and make existing programmers more productive.

In my view this type of system will only be usable by Real Computer Scientists and will completely kill off the workaday hacker. Think of all the people who bitterly complain that a C++ compiler does something unexpected under the banner of UB. That crowd cannot cope with a world in which you have to exactly describe your requirements to an AI. It is also analogous to TDD, so all the TDD haters, which is the overwhel…

What’s a workaday hacker and what’s UB?

Re: AlphaCode as a dog speaking mediocre English

#160
post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We're not seeing exponential rates of progress, in my opinion. We've been on the steep part of an S-curve.

When you're on that curve, it's indistinguishable until you hit the plateau. We're in an era where AI is continuing to improve and has already surpassed a level that many people doubted was achievable. Nobody knows when that progress will plateau. It's entirely possible that we plateau _after_ surpassing human-level intelligence.

The AI technology today has practical value for some use cases but it's basically just clever parlor tricks. There has been near zero discernable progress toward artificial general intelligence. We don't yet have a computer that can learn and make optimal resource usage decisions in an open world environment as well as a mouse. In most respects we're not even at the insect level yet.
Post reply on HN