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Inkscape 1.1.2

inkscape.org

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Re: Inkscape 1.1.2

#21

Post by outsomnia »

grenoire wrote: post #2

I am having some serious slowdown issues since 1.* on Win 10, so I'm stuck on 0.92. I have no qualms with it, but the issue plagues all my Win 10 machines and I just wonder what's going on, and if I'm a select minority with it. Besides that, thanks Inkscape for being such an incredibly useful vector tool!

On a Linux 4K Wayland desktop, Inkscape has been slower a year or two ago, this last 6 months it has become really fast panning and zooming even fairly complex pages.

The guys there have been doing great work. Maybe they need more helping hands that care about windows.

Re: Inkscape 1.1.2

#22

Post by zeruch »

grenoire wrote: post #2

I am having some serious slowdown issues since 1.* on Win 10, so I'm stuck on 0.92. I have no qualms with it, but the issue plagues all my Win 10 machines and I just wonder what's going on, and if I'm a select minority with it. Besides that, thanks Inkscape for being such an incredibly useful vector tool!

I had marginal performance degradation, but that may be due to the specific techniques I use it for, but there definitely was a change southward, just not anywhere nearly as poor as I'm hearing from others.

Inkscape is still very usable/utile, but I certainly don't want that trend to continue, as it would rapidly become not so.

Re: Inkscape 1.1.2

#23

Post by commoner »

sprash wrote: post #19
chrismorgan wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m also fairly bitter about the handling of 1.0 on Windows. I reported various problems at the first beta in moderate detail, my report was more or less ignored and they went ahead with various significant regressions in performance and UI, largely because no developer was interested enough in Windows, and I and others evidently failed to convince them of just how bad it was on Windows; GTK+ 3 in general has shown a…

GTK is a GNOME library and GNOME has shown in the past that they not only don't care about third party software but are actually extremely harmful to the community to the point that you might as well call it sabotage. The transition from GTK2 to GTK3 was extremely painful, had no benefits for anyone except GNOME and had many regressions across the board. The right course of action for Inkscape would be to switch back…

Display scaling is only supported by GTK 3 and later, so downgrading to GTK 2 would result in a blurry interface for a lot of users (and not just GNOME users). 1080p or higher resolution laptops and 4K monitors are quite common nowadays.

I can't agree with excluding all GNOME users from using an application, since it's not the fault of GNOME users in general that it's difficult to transition between major GTK versions.

Re: Inkscape 1.1.2

#24

Post by legulere »

grenoire wrote: post #2

I am having some serious slowdown issues since 1.* on Win 10, so I'm stuck on 0.92. I have no qualms with it, but the issue plagues all my Win 10 machines and I just wonder what's going on, and if I'm a select minority with it. Besides that, thanks Inkscape for being such an incredibly useful vector tool!

Same issue on OS X

Re: Inkscape 1.1.2

#25

Post by zibzab »

AdamBelis wrote: post #12
zibzab wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To avoid the extreme slowdown (and crash after a while) on win10, close the document property tab (!!) Anyway, inkscape has really disappointed me with multiple serious regressions. This + UI issues + layout problems + zoom buttons disappearing + crash due to version incompatibility + not remembering what unit you use + DPI screwup got me wondering if the people in charge really got what it takes to run the biggest F…

It's easy to forget that Inkscape is run purely with volunteers, is a charity with 0 employees. I get that these problems are frustrating but maybe it would be more appropriate to wonder how is even possible that this project runs so well :D. Some technical problems are outside our power. Mainly performance regression was introduced by gtk3. Which was a big blow to the whole project because it took 5years of work. An…

I hear you, and as a FOSS maintaineryaelf I agree that it is frustrating to see all complaints but no volunteers.

But, many issues in Inkscape are due to bugs introduced by changes that were not properly tested. If you have resources to change things around, you should also test the outcome properly before you hit that release button.

Re: Inkscape 1.1.2

#26

Post by chrismorgan »

commoner wrote: post #23
sprash wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

GTK is a GNOME library and GNOME has shown in the past that they not only don't care about third party software but are actually extremely harmful to the community to the point that you might as well call it sabotage. The transition from GTK2 to GTK3 was extremely painful, had no benefits for anyone except GNOME and had many regressions across the board. The right course of action for Inkscape would be to switch back…

Display scaling is only supported by GTK 3 and later, so downgrading to GTK 2 would result in a blurry interface for a lot of users (and not just GNOME users). 1080p or higher resolution laptops and 4K monitors are quite common nowadays. I can't agree with excluding all GNOME users from using an application, since it's not the fault of GNOME users in general that it's difficult to transition between major GTK version…

Eh, GTK as a whole is… well, not healthy for cross-platform development. It used to be a good deal better (though it was never really excellent), but from GNOME 3 they’ve pretty much decided to flat-out ignore other platforms and their conventions, and shift GTK from being GNOME-focused but fairly platform agnostic with pretty good look-and-feel theming to being just GNOME GNOME GNOME and wildly out of place in look and feel everywhere else.

Of course, other options in a similar space like Qt aren’t entirely better in that they don’t behave fully like GNOME on GNOME platforms. The best cross-platform native-feel apps, like Firefox, tend to use GTK on Linux (or possibly KDE/Qt in KDE?) and other things on other platforms.

As a Linux user I inevitably use quite a bit of GTK software (though barely any GNOME stuff, if you savvy the distinction I’m drawing), but I dislike almost all of the directions it’s headed in since GNOME 3. Decent scaling is one of the few redeeming features.

sprash is describing a very—ahh—ideologically pure position, but I do deeply sympathise with a desire for a return to the GTK+ 2 ways. My ideal would probably be to scrap GTK+ 3 and 4 and create 5 derived mostly from GTK+ 2’s philosophies, just including the good technical parts of 3 and 4, but determinedly not a full style unto itself. Also I’m fed up with client-side decorations matter and want better support for server-side decorations, as was done traditionally and as is still generally preferable on Windows and in most Linux window managers, or even platform-matching client-side decorations, which would be good for macOS and Windows and frankly GNOME.

GNOME has basically sabotaged GTK as a cross-platform library—even as a Linux-wide thing (apart from KDE). They’ve taken it over to serve their own purposes and vision. Their vision does improve and unify some parts of GNOME desktops, but as a user of something other than GNOME (Sway), I don’t like most of what they’ve done to GTK.

Re: Inkscape 1.1.2

#27

Post by speedgoose »

WanderPanda wrote: post #11
speedgoose wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Debugging and contributing to large and complex C++ projects is not trivial. I personally do debug and contribute to open source projects using technologies I’m confident with, but when it comes to Inkscape I can’t do much more than to do nothing and to hope for the best.

Filing reproducible issues is probably a good start and anybody can do it

A good issue report requires some knowledge and expertise though. Anyone can say it doesn’t work as expected, but it’s harder to identify and reproduce the problem and provide all the useful details.

Re: Inkscape 1.1.2

#28

Post by adhesive_wombat »

grenoire wrote: post #2

I am having some serious slowdown issues since 1.* on Win 10, so I'm stuck on 0.92. I have no qualms with it, but the issue plagues all my Win 10 machines and I just wonder what's going on, and if I'm a select minority with it. Besides that, thanks Inkscape for being such an incredibly useful vector tool!

I've been plagued with lagging and crashes on Linux too in the last few months.

But then I rebuilt from master in an attempt to get a traceback or profile to report and it went away, so hopefully whatever that was has been fixed and just got released.

Though I have to say I think hiding the snap controls behind a button, as opposed to a toolbar, is a mistake.

Re: Inkscape 1.1.2

#29

Post by dantondwa »

chrismorgan wrote: post #26
commoner wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Display scaling is only supported by GTK 3 and later, so downgrading to GTK 2 would result in a blurry interface for a lot of users (and not just GNOME users). 1080p or higher resolution laptops and 4K monitors are quite common nowadays. I can't agree with excluding all GNOME users from using an application, since it's not the fault of GNOME users in general that it's difficult to transition between major GTK version…

Eh, GTK as a whole is… well, not healthy for cross-platform development. It used to be a good deal better (though it was never really excellent ), but from GNOME 3 they’ve pretty much decided to flat-out ignore other platforms and their conventions, and shift GTK from being GNOME-focused but fairly platform agnostic with pretty good look-and-feel theming to being just GNOME GNOME GNOME and wildly out of place in look…

Doesn't GTK4 address your complaints? To a certain degree, I think they've realized what you say. GTK4:

- decouples GNOME and GTK. They've created a new library, called libadwaita, that hosts the GNOME stuff.

- brings big performance improvements (it has GL and Vulkan backends)

- is much better on macOS and Windows.

Anyway, I agree with you on your points. One of the issues of opensource graphic programs is that the toolkits that are available are quite problematic/don't care about this use case. This is not just about GTK, as QT has also been causing a lot of headaches to the Krita developers. It is not by chance that Blender, which draws the UI using its own toolkit, is not affected by these issues and has a fantastic, fast UI.

Re: Inkscape 1.1.2

#30

Post by zelphirkalt »

chrismorgan wrote: post #17
grenoire wrote: post #2

I am having some serious slowdown issues since 1.* on Win 10, so I'm stuck on 0.92. I have no qualms with it, but the issue plagues all my Win 10 machines and I just wonder what's going on, and if I'm a select minority with it. Besides that, thanks Inkscape for being such an incredibly useful vector tool!

I’m also fairly bitter about the handling of 1.0 on Windows. I reported various problems at the first beta in moderate detail, my report was more or less ignored and they went ahead with various significant regressions in performance and UI, largely because no developer was interested enough in Windows, and I and others evidently failed to convince them of just how bad it was on Windows; GTK+ 3 in general has shown a…

It might even be, that the developers do not own a Windows machine. Did you ask them, whether they have one to test on and reproduce the slowdown? Or perhaps offer to buy them one? It is a pity that things slow down for you on Windows, but I don't really see, how it is their responsibility to cater to a proprietary system, that is actively hostile to its users.

Preferrably it wouls not slow down for you, ofc, but they may well deem it out of scope of their project to fix issues for asystem, that they do not have the code for to look at where it is going wrong, or simply do not have the time and resources to deal with that. Add to that, that any day MS could destroy the fruit of that work again.

I can understand, that they don't want to invest resources into that.

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