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What’s so hard about understanding consciousness?

nautil.us

21–30 of 393 posts

Re: What’s so hard about understanding consciousness?

#21
I believe people with psychedelic experiences can attest to the controlled hallucination theory of consciousness. But only those with a materialist world view while idealists may posit souls or alternate realities.

Imagination is also a part in probabilistic decision making, an unhinged prediction machine.

Re: What’s so hard about understanding consciousness?

#22

My pet theory is that people who think that consciousness is not a hard problem are P-Zombies that can't experience the problem. On a more serious note, as a materialist, I have a really hard time accepting that my self/experience can't be explained materialistically. It's like I have this nice theory of everything, but it fails when I try to apply it to myself. Reminds me of Gödel's incompleteness theorem.

I'm pretty sure I've written this exact comment before. I'd have so much more respect for philosophers who simply admit that nobody has made any progress on the hard problem (other than increased clarity on what it is) than those who dismiss, minimize, or otherwise pooh-pooh the hard problem. The fact that the problem is "unproductive" is not a problem with the hard problem, it's only a problem for philosophers' career advancement.

Re: What’s so hard about understanding consciousness?

#23
What I find fascinating about consciousness is that it seems to be bound to your location. But how and why? Why are you inside of your body and not in someone elses?

The article poses this question, but leaves it unanswered.

For me it begs the question: If conscousness is bound to a location, is it possible to transfer consciousness from one entity to another? Is there some kind of thing we did not yet detect? What happens when you die or someone is born?

Or maybe, we all (humans, animals and things) share a single consciousness and for each Planck time duration switch through all of them without knowing?

I love to think about stuff like this, but are those questions even answerable?

Re: What’s so hard about understanding consciousness?

#24
One troubling analogy would be occasionalism.

Occasionalists believe that in order for cause and effect to work, God has to intercede. This rather elegantly deals with a whole load of theoretical problems around causal realism.

If you were an occasionalist, you might think, if such a thing as a 'god-of-the-gaps' exist, it should be possible to build a device that mimics its powers, a 'god machine'. Such a device would be very useful.

Except, if occasionalism is wrong, and the universe simply doesn't work like that, it's obviously going to be totally impossible to build a machine that replicates the effect, or to understand how the effect could function.

What if consciousness is just another 'god-of-the-gaps', and we can't replicate it or understand it, because it's fundamentally a nonsensical concept?

Re: What’s so hard about understanding consciousness?

#25
post #12
post #2

Thanks for the link. I agree with Seth that consciousness is much like a controlled hallucination - after all, we don't experience reality directly, but through the predictions of our brain. But then the question is, why do you need this hallucination? I suspect that consciousness evolved because it makes an organism more capable than one who doesn't. But what does consciousness offer over just taking in sensory inpu…

> we don't experience reality directly That muddies the water, IMO. We do experience reality directly: our nerve endings do. The next step is processing, which is somewhat mediated by low-level expectations. This takes place at sub-conscious levels. Conscious perception comes much later, and is obviously more filtered. To call it a hallucination is word play.

> We do experience reality directly: our nerve endings do.

Depending on how you define "reality" we only experience a tiny subset of it. We can only see/hear/touch/smell/taste a very restricted universe, only what our "antennas" can detect. In fact I would argue that we experience close to 0% of all of reality. On top of this extremely restricted input our processing of it is imperfect which means some of what we experience has nothing to do with reality.

Re: What’s so hard about understanding consciousness?

#26

What I find fascinating about consciousness is that it seems to be bound to your location. But how and why? Why are you inside of your body and not in someone elses? The article poses this question, but leaves it unanswered. For me it begs the question: If conscousness is bound to a location, is it possible to transfer consciousness from one entity to another? Is there some kind of thing we did not yet detect? What h…

This is only fascinating if you refuse to accept a non-supernatural or non-metaphysical definition of consciousness. Otherwise, most of these questions become trivial when consciousness is considered as a physical, biological process bound to the brain.

Why is consciousness bound to a person's location? Because their brain is bound inside their skull.

Why are you inside your body and not someone else's? Because your brain is inside your body and not someone else's.

Is it possible to transfer consciousness from one entity to another? transfer, no, because consciousness is inextricably linked to the brain. There's no separation between the hardware and the "software."

What happens when you die or someone is born? Nothing. No afterlife, to karma, no reincarnation, no bardo, nothing.

And finally, are those questions even answerable?

Yes, I believe they are, but many people are uncomfortable with the ramifications of the answer as best supported by available evidence - we are purely physical beings existing within a purely physical universe. Despite all of the evidence from biology, neurology, chemistry, physics, etc. failing to show any credible evidence of a supernatural or non-biological component of consciousness apart from the brain, many people keep hoping someone will discover the soul someday and be free of the prison of material reality.

Re: What’s so hard about understanding consciousness?

#27

One troubling analogy would be occasionalism. Occasionalists believe that in order for cause and effect to work, God has to intercede. This rather elegantly deals with a whole load of theoretical problems around causal realism. If you were an occasionalist, you might think, if such a thing as a 'god-of-the-gaps' exist, it should be possible to build a device that mimics its powers, a 'god machine'. Such a device woul…

> If you were an occasionalist, you might think, if such a thing as a 'god-of-the-gaps' exist, it should be possible to build a device that mimics its powers, a 'god machine'.

Then that occasionalist god might interfere and break your machine and maybe break you too for trying to emulate a god.

Re: What’s so hard about understanding consciousness?

#28

What I find fascinating about consciousness is that it seems to be bound to your location. But how and why? Why are you inside of your body and not in someone elses? The article poses this question, but leaves it unanswered. For me it begs the question: If conscousness is bound to a location, is it possible to transfer consciousness from one entity to another? Is there some kind of thing we did not yet detect? What h…

Why is it bound to your location? You are just getting sensory input from a particular set of devices: eyes, ears, tactile, brain (thoughts/feelings/memories). But 'you' are not any of these. 'You', the observer receiving and experiencing all these readings, can be anywhere.

With meditation, you can get a clearer sense of what is really 'you', and what is just being observed/experienced by 'you'. But 'you' are not your body, or your thoughts, or your memories, or your feelings. Distilled, the 'you' of all living things could well be exactly the same - it is just what is fed to them by the hardware differs.

Re: What’s so hard about understanding consciousness?

#29

What I find fascinating about consciousness is that it seems to be bound to your location. But how and why? Why are you inside of your body and not in someone elses? The article poses this question, but leaves it unanswered. For me it begs the question: If conscousness is bound to a location, is it possible to transfer consciousness from one entity to another? Is there some kind of thing we did not yet detect? What h…

To me it's obvious: since consciousness arises from external and internal stimuli of the body, part of the physical world that it could perceive and affect is limited by the physical capabilities of the body. If there was a technology to hook up a computer to your brain and you could then have it feed you data from a sensor located somewhere far away, you would effectively extend the physical capabilities of your body, thus extending the spatial presence of your consciousness.
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