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Programming's Dirtiest Little Secret

steve-yegge.blogspot.com

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Re: Programming's Dirtiest Little Secret

#91

Post by cstejerean »

whacked_new wrote: post #64
shiro wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It may depend on your style. I know some programmers who can just construct a complete function in their head during thinking. For them, typing is just a mechanical step to dump the code into a computer. You know, those who claim they can code with cat >foo.c. If you're one of them, probably typing speed doesn't matter much, since it is not the major part of development. I'm more like an oil-painter. I have to put so…

> I know some programmers who can just construct a complete function in their head during thinking. This is interesting. What level of detail do they go into? Most people should be able to do this at a simple level. The fastest example is probably a wrapper function: you probably know 100% what you intend to type before hitting the first key. If you are making a bigger function that has intermediate variables, naming…

If all you're doing all day is writing wrapper functions you need a better language or a better job.

Re: Programming's Dirtiest Little Secret

#92

Post by michaelneale »

I actually don't know anyone that doesn't touch type that is under the age of 35 (but perhaps I need to pay more attention). Anyone that went and did an engineering level degree surely would be able to (due to thesis writing at least).

Even when I was in high school (back pre 1992) we learned by having a tea-towel over our hands and having to type without looking.

Re: Programming's Dirtiest Little Secret

#93

Post by cstejerean »

Timothee wrote: post #87
caustic wrote: post #66

Guys, could you please take a look at the project I am working on: http://keybr.com I thought it could be a good touch typing trainer web application.

It's nicely done! I'm not sure that I like the fact that the text doesn't mean anything... I guess it's in purpose so that you have to look at the words and not type mechanically for words you know but at the same time, I spend a lot more time figuring out what is going on...

The words are throwing me off. Not because I can't type them fast enough, but because I can't read them as fast as I type so I need to slow down and pay attention to the letters.

Re: Programming's Dirtiest Little Secret

#94

Post by bootload »

kqr2 wrote: post #47
bootload wrote: post #26

"... Yeev noticed that one of the electives, surely placed there by mistake, was Typing. Like, on a typewriter ..." What an elective? Mine was compulsory complete with manual typewriters and battle-axe teacher. One thing I do miss about those old clunkers was the solid feel the keys had. You had to learn to position your index fingers at 'F' and 'J' remember where each key was positioned and hit hard. So letters like…

The Happy Hacking Lite keyboard is nice and compact with a solid feel: http://pfuca-store.stores.yahoo.net/haphackeylit1.html Previously they also carried a "professional" model which featured blank keys. Not only was it "l33t", but it was supposed to improve your speed by forcing you to learn to touch type which of course is required for late night hacking sessions in the dark. Finally, there is the classic carpal t…

"... Previously they also carried a "professional" model which featured blank keys. Not only was it "l33t", but it was supposed to improve your speed by forcing you to learn to touch type which of course is required for late night hacking sessions in the dark ..."

That is pretty sad. While I can touch-type, typing accuracy at night decreases not because I can't find 'F' & 'H'. Must be murder with long passwords.

Re: Programming's Dirtiest Little Secret

#95

Post by menloparkbum »

bootload wrote: post #94
kqr2 wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Happy Hacking Lite keyboard is nice and compact with a solid feel: http://pfuca-store.stores.yahoo.net/haphackeylit1.html Previously they also carried a "professional" model which featured blank keys. Not only was it "l33t", but it was supposed to improve your speed by forcing you to learn to touch type which of course is required for late night hacking sessions in the dark. Finally, there is the classic carpal t…

"... Previously they also carried a "professional" model which featured blank keys. Not only was it "l33t", but it was supposed to improve your speed by forcing you to learn to touch type which of course is required for late night hacking sessions in the dark ..." That is pretty sad. While I can touch-type, typing accuracy at night decreases not because I can't find 'F' & 'H'. Must be murder with long passwords.

At risk of public shame, I actually use a blank keyboard. And, I switched to it from a kinesis ergo. O_o

Regarding passwords, for the past 10 years I've chosen passwords based on "shape." It is a trick I learned from a sysadmin friend, and know more than a couple other sysadmin guys who do the same. It can suck when you switch to a keyboard on a mobile device and the keys aren't where you think they are going to be.

Re: Programming's Dirtiest Little Secret

#96

Post by ojbyrne »

DenisM wrote: post #89
ojbyrne wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Umm, nice rationalization. But that's 2000 lines of debugged, documented code. It takes a lot more typing than just 2000 x 80 characters. The article basically describes why. Plus he's not talking about "average."

Even if you are 10 times the average that's coming out to 55 lines per day. Seriously, did you ever find your coding constranied by your typing speed?

Actually, often. Back when I used to write for school (with a pen) I always had the feeling of losing ideas because I couldn't write as fast as I could think. I don't feel it nearly as much when coding (or writing for that matter), I think because I type faster than I used to be able to write.

Re: Programming's Dirtiest Little Secret

#97

Post by nostrademons »

biohacker42 wrote: post #77
johnyzee wrote: post #53

Not looking at the keyboard as you type is important for secretaries who have to copy text off a hard copy. For a programmer I'd say it makes little difference. But hey, don't let that get in the way of smug superiority.

Can you convince me you're just as fast if you have to look at the keyboard? I bet you'd be faster if you didn't need to.

I switched from typing qwerty while looking at the keyboard (but definitely not hunt-and-peck; I knew where the keys were, I just needed a trigger) to touch-typing Dvorak. My typing speed went from 70 WPM to about 75-80. That's not all that much of a difference, and much of it may be attributable to Dvorak.

I really don't think it makes that much of a difference, as long as you're not hunt-and-peck.

Incidentally, my speed now is about 55 WPM because the T and M keys on my lapop are broken and often don't regiser. You can lose more with bad hardware than you gain wih good training.

Re: Programming's Dirtiest Little Secret

#98

Post by nostrademons »

mechanical_fish wrote: post #71
LogicHoleFlaw wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I keep threatening to get two foot pedals. One for CTRL and one for ESC. I think it would give me vim superpowers.

I have a pedal for my Kinesis keyboard, but I almost never use it. When I do use it it's for something like num lock... I tried it for Emacs ctrl and/or meta but it didn't work well. The big problem is that I don't keep my feet frozen in one spot for hours, so when I go to press the pedal I have to find the darn thing by feeling around with my feet. You don't have to lose much time doing this before the point of the…

What sort of pedal, how much did it cost, and where'd you get it?

I ask because my sister had this neat idea for a hardware hack: a digital music stand. The idea being that page turns really suck when you play any instrument that takes two hands (we're both violinists), and if you could hook it up to a foot pedal, you could control the music without putting down your instrument. I also pointed out that a digital music stand would cost at least as much as a computer, but now that you can get laptops for $98, this may be doable...

Plus, think of all the people on YouTube that you see lean over to stop recording. If it doesn't already exist, software to control a webcam through a foot pedal would be a great boon to YouTubers everywhere. The porn industry would love it too - that bra unclasp is so much sexier when she's not blatantly fiddling with her webcam.

Re: Programming's Dirtiest Little Secret

#99

Post by menloparkbum »

nostrademons wrote: post #98
mechanical_fish wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have a pedal for my Kinesis keyboard, but I almost never use it. When I do use it it's for something like num lock... I tried it for Emacs ctrl and/or meta but it didn't work well. The big problem is that I don't keep my feet frozen in one spot for hours, so when I go to press the pedal I have to find the darn thing by feeling around with my feet. You don't have to lose much time doing this before the point of the…

What sort of pedal, how much did it cost, and where'd you get it? I ask because my sister had this neat idea for a hardware hack: a digital music stand. The idea being that page turns really suck when you play any instrument that takes two hands (we're both violinists), and if you could hook it up to a foot pedal, you could control the music without putting down your instrument. I also pointed out that a digital musi…

Kinesis has their own foot pedals.

http://www.kinesis-ergo.com/foot.htm

There are a number of midi/usb pedalboards, but they have tons of pedals and are relatively expensive.

There are also a lot of DIY footswitch projects. Check this one out, it is for turning pages inside digital music stand software. :)

http://www.instructables.com/id/USB-Foot-Pedal/

Also, I used to be in orchestras. A Kindle for sheet music would be neat. Especially if it had built in metronome and tuner for practicing. Might take away some of the old-school ambiance though.

Re: Programming's Dirtiest Little Secret

#100

Post by fendale »

caustic wrote: post #66

Guys, could you please take a look at the project I am working on: http://keybr.com I thought it could be a good touch typing trainer web application.

I just gave that app a try there - I like it.

I second (or third now!) that I don't like the meaningless words. Makes it much harder to type them I reckon, and some of the words seem to be real words, but with missing letters, so you find yourself typing the real word, which is wrong!!

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