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Google to turn on activity tracking for many users who turned it off

news.ycombinator.com

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Re: Google to turn on activity tracking for many users who turned it off

#271

Post by zht »

riverguardian wrote: post #70

Hello hello, PM for the feature checking in here. amf12's reply is quite on-point. Web and App Activity is designed to store search activity across all Google services, and we're splitting Workspace data out since it's governed by strict data handling guarantees, with the hope that more people will feel comfortable getting the benefits of better search in Workspace without having to opt-into search history being trac…

I feel sort of bad for this comment.

The reason is because the reason given is perfectly sound. “We have to split this out because of perfect reasonable reasons like laws, data retention policies, etc etc”.

And everything afterwards is pure unadulterated propaganda.

I don’t know if the commenter knows how patronizing they sound. “We did this for you because even though you’ve previously explicitly opted out, we think we know better than you and we’re doing you a favor to enhance your experience”.

Imagine going into a restaurant and saying “I really don’t enjoy a medium rare steak please make it medium well” and having the chef say “ok fine but medium rare steak is the best way to enjoy it so I made it medium rare despite what you previously explicitly told me enjoy”

I really wouldn’t expect this sort of borderline gaslighting from a company like Google. I really can’t tell how many PMs and engineers on this team either a) whole heartedly believe in this or b) have convinced themselves this is a user friendly change or c) knows that something feels off but their paycheck depends on it so let’s not fight too much about it, d) feels some reservations and have voiced up but have bills to pay so didnt rock the boat

Re: Google to turn on activity tracking for many users who turned it off

#272

Post by the_pwner224 »

pilif wrote: post #171
greyface- wrote: post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You challenged the tone of the question, but you didn't attempt to answer it. Do you believe that nobody in their right mind would want this functionality turned off?

I'm relying on search history in my Google Workspace account every single day. It's very convenient and I have a feeling most people would agree with that. What is a double-edged sword is how this history is being used. If it's just about offering search history for each individual user, then it's not a privacy issue and strictly an improvement in convenience. Turning it on offers the convenience, turning it off, rem…

This is the classic "my use case is the only use case and anyone who thinks otherwise is stupid" response.

> Why do you believe that anybody in their right mind would want this functionality turned off?

Because they want to. We don't need to give you a reason. (I know you're not GP)

I keep browsing history in Firefox turned off. Not out of privacy concerns or anything like that - it's not leaving my computer and nobody else inspects what sites I've been visiting - but just because I don't like having it. If I find something useful I bookmark it.

I do the same in Drive and Gmail. Because I just don't like having the history suggestions pop up when I'm trying to search. It's annoying and obnoxious and frankly quite useless IMO. I can type the query again.

Re: Google to turn on activity tracking for many users who turned it off

#273

Post by tazjin »

gobip wrote: post #213
evocatus wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks for confirming that Google is no longer run by the same people I trusted (at least, somewhat more than I do now) over a decade ago. I encourage everyone to make the leap to DDG or some other search engine that doesn't just treat you as a data cow to be milked for your precious, precious "insights." Even GMail is no longer an attractive proposition - the risk of being locked out (perhaps, even automatically!) o…

What do you use in replacement for GMail?

I recently moved to Yandex 360. We previously had DNS, mail etc. on Google until an outage[0] occured. The outage was the classical story of "billing error in related Play Store (!) account nuked entire GCP setup", which diminished trust enough that I decided to move everything away from Google. I'm a Xoogler, but even then getting through to the right support channels is hard.

Yandex services are pretty nice (they have an equivalent to most Google things), but even more important for me is that - even on the lowest plan - you can talk to a real human in support within minutes, 24/7.

[0]: https://b.tvl.fyi/issues/155

Re: Google to turn on activity tracking for many users who turned it off

#274

Post by zinekeller »

diamondage wrote: post #256
evocatus wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks for confirming that Google is no longer run by the same people I trusted (at least, somewhat more than I do now) over a decade ago. I encourage everyone to make the leap to DDG or some other search engine that doesn't just treat you as a data cow to be milked for your precious, precious "insights." Even GMail is no longer an attractive proposition - the risk of being locked out (perhaps, even automatically!) o…

DDG leaks data like a sieve. When you type a query it's present in the URL. Use an engine like onesearch.com which obfuscate this. (or get DDG to add this basic feature!)

If you're really concerned with that, turn off GET mode, which turns on POST mode (https://duckduckgo.com/settings#privacy or https://duckduckgo.com/?kg=p for a direct link).

Re: Google to turn on activity tracking for many users who turned it off

#275

Post by scim-knox-twox »

usrbinbash wrote: post #246
riverguardian wrote: post #70

Hello hello, PM for the feature checking in here. amf12's reply is quite on-point. Web and App Activity is designed to store search activity across all Google services, and we're splitting Workspace data out since it's governed by strict data handling guarantees, with the hope that more people will feel comfortable getting the benefits of better search in Workspace without having to opt-into search history being trac…

The default for any data collection no matter what it is for, should be OFF. End of discussion.

That's why I don't understand GPC (https://globalprivacycontrol.org/). GPC setting is for opt-out, without GPC header it's treating like opt-in.

> Now you can exercise your legal privacy rights in one step via Global Privacy Control (GPC), required under the California Consumer Protection Act (CCPA) and Europe’s Global Data Protection Regulation (GDPR).

I don't think this is consistent with GDPR. GDPR require opt-out by default - no data can be sent without person consent.

Re: Google to turn on activity tracking for many users who turned it off

#276

Post by JaimeThompson »

People seem to forget that even if you pay Google you aren't their actual user, you are just a bundle of data to be sold for ad revenue. Paying, it seems, just makes you more valuable because now Google knows you pay for services and that signal is worth more for ad targeting.

Re: Google to turn on activity tracking for many users who turned it off

#277

Post by pessimizer »

snowwrestler wrote: post #261
Groxx wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This has been in my app for a couple years - I hate it every time. Not only is it very clearly advertising, it's nearly always useless because the restaurant/whatever is barely or not at all visible on the approach to the turn. It's pretty clear they're going for paid landmarks, not useful ones (though I don't like landmark-directions either way).

Could someone please point me to the spot in Google’s ads product to purchase these ads-in-navigation-directions? If these are really ads, there will be a place to buy them. Google doesn’t run ads for free.

They don't have to let small customers buy them, or put them up for auction like their other ads. Just offer it to big companies directly, especially ones that might be visual landmarks like a McDonald's or a Dunkin Donuts.

Re: Google to turn on activity tracking for many users who turned it off

#278

Post by uberman »

pilif wrote: post #171
greyface- wrote: post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You challenged the tone of the question, but you didn't attempt to answer it. Do you believe that nobody in their right mind would want this functionality turned off?

I'm relying on search history in my Google Workspace account every single day. It's very convenient and I have a feeling most people would agree with that. What is a double-edged sword is how this history is being used. If it's just about offering search history for each individual user, then it's not a privacy issue and strictly an improvement in convenience. Turning it on offers the convenience, turning it off, rem…

I don't need nor want search history. If search works then it works. If I search for a term I now believe whatever settings I have will be ignored and I can expect ads related to that term to follow me around.

My kid did a single search and play for a Taylor Swift song on my phone and now she shadows me all across the internet.

I understand this is slightly different as this is in "workspace" but I now assume that is irrelevant.

Re: Google to turn on activity tracking for many users who turned it off

#279

Post by eganist »

basisword wrote: post #180
riverguardian wrote: post #70

Hello hello, PM for the feature checking in here. amf12's reply is quite on-point. Web and App Activity is designed to store search activity across all Google services, and we're splitting Workspace data out since it's governed by strict data handling guarantees, with the hope that more people will feel comfortable getting the benefits of better search in Workspace without having to opt-into search history being trac…

Your reason for splitting this into two separate settings is understandable. >> ...with the hope that more people will feel comfortable getting the benefits of better search in Workspace without having to opt-into search history being tracked for all Google services. This is unacceptable. People have already opted out or been opted out by their admin. If they want to opt back in now that the setting is more granular,…

> Let's be honest, the real reason for making this opt-out again is that you hope lots of people won't notice and you can start collecting their data. Please reconsider.

I'm keen on seeing if there's any legal code or case law that addresses opting someone back in who's already opted out.

And I'm hoping there's personal culpability for the change, too. Not just corporate fines. But this is probably just wishful thinking on my part.

Re: Google to turn on activity tracking for many users who turned it off

#280

Post by scim-knox-twox »

foxfluff wrote: post #156
lumost wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On the other side, DuckDuckGo is becoming pretty reasonable. I now only need to flip back to google for some hard to search technical topics. DDG also brings up a ton more of the old internet, you get way more variety in the search results.

Will they stay reasonable? "DuckDuckGo gains revenue via advertisements and affiliate programs." Today I'm quite skeptical of any business that doesn't have a proper business model. I've seen it too many times: offer nice free things until you have enough users, and then start squeezing. Bait and switch. At this point I'm more interested in internet search that isn't reliant on the goodwill and dignity of a private c…

> Today I'm quite skeptical of any business that doesn't have a proper business model.

But they have? DDG was founded 13 years ago...

And "bussiness model": https://wikiless.org/wiki/DuckDuckGo?lang=en#Business_model And: https://www.nichepursuits.com/how-does-duckduckgo-make-money...

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