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Career advice nobody gave me: Never ignore a recruiter

alexchesser.medium.com

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Re: Career advice nobody gave me: Never ignore a recruiter

#151
I Dissent.

I've seen so many shady tricks pulled by recruiters. I'm sure it goes both ways, but never forget the recruiter isn't in the business of helping you, they're in the business of helping the people who pay them.

Seen recruiters low-ball staff, or tell the person that they weren't as good as other candidates... "but if you lower your day rate to be more aligned with your junior-level skills..." So when the person shows up, they feel deflated since they think we thought they were junior... but in fact, we loved them and just didn't have enough budget to hire them at the right rate -- and the recruiter helped us get their rates down because at the end of the day the recruiter only cared about putting seats in chairs for us.

Seen recruiters spam over candidates without so much as doing a basic screening interview. "Oh yeah, he's great... he knows JavaScript and English..." and they're literally just looking at the poor guy's LinkedIn and they haven't ever spoken with him past a few copy-paste emails. It's a numbers game to them. They don't want you, as the person paying them, to ever feel like their shelves are empty.

Seen recruiters promise people visas along with the offer letter... then for whatever reason, if the job shifts, the recruiters just cancel the contract and the person would get deported. Saw this in Sydney A LOT. The recruiters and staffing agencies don't care at all what happens to the person, as long as they get a commission. They lie and over-promise, and sell-sell-sell... and even if they only have a 3-month contract they'll promise someone a year, then just switch it last minute or have a cancellation clause.

As someone who worked for a Digital Agency where we hired a lot of people through recruiters... the number of times some poor bloke would come up to me and be like, "So... 3 months probation then I'm full time? That's what the recruiter said... now you can get me a visa and I'll be able to bring my wife over here too?" and I'd have to be like, "Yeah sorry, Johnny... this was just a 3-month gig." Had one guy, "But I gave up my family's visa for this... the recruiter promised me higher pay and that you'd take over my visa..." Felt awful. And the poor guy almost certainly had to leave Sydney when the job was done.

Worse... my GM wouldn't let me fire that recruiter. "They give us the best rates..." Was all so shady. Left me with the solid impression that these people were all just bottom feeders. Willing to do anything to make a buck that day.

Re: Career advice nobody gave me: Never ignore a recruiter

#152

Add NYC to that list as well. There's no reason to move to either of those cities in 2022.

> There's no reason to move to either of those cities in 2022

Hm, and here I was, thinking that different people like living in different places for different reasons!

Re: Career advice nobody gave me: Never ignore a recruiter

#153

Q for engineers on this thread: would you be more open to a "recruiter reach-out" if that person _is_ an engineer themselves but independently also helps startups build teams as a recruiter?

The more you differentiate yourself, the more likely I am to listen. My priority is: 1. Internal recruiters. They have real pull. 2. External recruiters that give me real information and give me quality information before I get on a call and why I might be interested. 3. External recruiters that are working with a company that I have prior interest in.

Below this, I usually don't respond.

4. Recruiters that ask if I can "get on a call" to get me details. 5. Recruiters from big name firms. (Robert Half et. al) 6. Low quality recruiters that have no connection to what I do.

Re: Career advice nobody gave me: Never ignore a recruiter

#154

Strong disagree. I've made it my policy to never work with a recruiter that isn't affiliated with the company they're hiring for. Recruiting farms like Cyber Recruiters (yuck) will do everything in their power to waste your time out of sheer incompetence and disinterest. I've "doubled" my salary plenty of times through this policy. But the real secret sauce is referrals. Companies always prioritize a strong referral,…

> I've "doubled" my salary plenty of times through this policy.

Meanwhile, I doubled my salary by responding to a recruiter.

Though FWIW, I was actively looking for new work at the time.

Re: Career advice nobody gave me: Never ignore a recruiter

#155

Strong disagree. I've made it my policy to never work with a recruiter that isn't affiliated with the company they're hiring for. Recruiting farms like Cyber Recruiters (yuck) will do everything in their power to waste your time out of sheer incompetence and disinterest. I've "doubled" my salary plenty of times through this policy. But the real secret sauce is referrals. Companies always prioritize a strong referral,…

> I've made it my policy to never work with a recruiter that isn't affiliated with the company they're hiring for.

This is a massive privilege. A lot of companies interview in a way that I couldn't pass years ago, so I depended on external recruiters to get me jobs. This was basically how I made a living in the South without a CS or CE degree.

The universal truth I see throughout every career advice thread is always take this advice with a grain of salt.

Re: Career advice nobody gave me: Never ignore a recruiter

#156

I also recommend a response to every recruiter, but you don't need to explain your privilege, you don't need to suck up to them, and you don't need to justify your actions. "Hey ____. Before we move forward, can you provide me with the company name, a job description, and the expected compensation. Regards"

I don't like to ignore recruiters, but it's hard to answer them correctly. I'm always looking for a nice way to articulate "I'm comfortable with my current job, but interested in exploring whether I'm being compensated fairly. I don't want to slam any doors. But, I am also not up for the hazing session of grinding leetcode, filling out online forms, doing take-home tests, phone screens, and 5 rounds of interviews, just to find out at the end of it all what my current market value is."

Re: Career advice nobody gave me: Never ignore a recruiter

#158
Here is my version:

Thanks for reaching out. I'm okay to travel to spend a week to work together every now and then but I'm working remote only and permanently from X1-Country and I'd only be interested in opportunities with compensations around X2 plus benefits and if I like their tech stack. Let me know when you have something that sounds like a match for that. Thanks again.

Re: Career advice nobody gave me: Never ignore a recruiter

#159

"It is a wonderful position of privilege to be in and I’m thankful for it." Insta-delete if I'm doing hiring... ? I've found folks who actually deliver seem to have less of this type of long winded stuff.

Do you have hard data to back that up or is it just anecdotal personal bristling whenever someone says "privilege"?

Real tech people don't blather.

Yeah, I know, that's not "hard data". It's a pretty consistent pattern, though. Tech people have to be able to communicate with precision; they usually don't do "blowing smoke".

Re: Career advice nobody gave me: Never ignore a recruiter

#160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the popular definition of "nepotism" is hiring one's family or close relations. I doubt anyone is advocating that.

Closeness isn't a requisite for nepotistic behavior, only undue bias due to personal familiarity. I don't think it's any less bad to hire someone you don't know all that well because you share friends than it is to hire people because they're you're close friend or a family member. The point is that it's exclusionary to outsiders, and outsiders tend to be the exact people tech needs more of.

Personal familiarity is a great tool though.

If a hiring manager knows someone, the kind of worker and individual they are, they are in a great position to know if they should hire them.

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