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Austrian DPA Ruling Against Google Paves the Way to EU-Based Cloud Services

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Re: Austrian DPA Ruling Against Google Paves the Way to EU-Based Cloud Services

#71

Post by mrweasel »

sirwitti wrote: post #3

This is already affecting websites and web apps. At least all of our customers are moving away from Google Analytics and many try to also get rid of other Google services like fonts and maps. I'm very interested to see what this changes in other european countries.

We can't sell AWS consulting services to anyone right now, haven't been able to for over a year, almost two I think. Non of our clients trust Amazon right now. The claims from AWS is that it's fine to host EU data in AWS, but very few companies are willing to risk that.

Re: Austrian DPA Ruling Against Google Paves the Way to EU-Based Cloud Services

#72

Post by RHSeeger »

yohannparis wrote: post #41
Deukhoofd wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or far simpler, revoke section 702 of the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act. It's an absolutely insane law anyhow, basically "we can spy on any data of non-American users of American services, without any restrictions"

I agree that section 702 is a bit extreme. But, at the heart of it, it makes sense. If foreigners can use services in your jurisdiction, you want to see what they do for security purposes. Nonetheless, it's against the belief of "innocent until proven guilty."

> If foreigners can use services in your jurisdiction, you want to see what they do for security purposes.

There are a LOT of things that law enforcement agencies want that they should not get. The fact that they want it or that it would be useful to them is not enough of an argument to give it to them. It has to be balanced against other factors, to decide what is best for society as a whole.

Re: Austrian DPA Ruling Against Google Paves the Way to EU-Based Cloud Services

#73

Post by zoobab »

DaiPlusPlus wrote: post #7
wbl wrote: post #4

EU based cloud services always could compete before. Now they will compete on the basis of being in the EU instead of being better.

Nah, what happens is the US-based companies will just geo-wall the data and throw more money at their EU-based AWS and Azure regions.

"throw more money at their EU-based AWS and Azure regions."

Impossible, the mother company is still american.

Re: Austrian DPA Ruling Against Google Paves the Way to EU-Based Cloud Services

#75

Post by mrweasel »

thisisnotatest1 wrote: post #65

Quoted post unavailable.

I think part of it is desperation. There is absolutely nothing the EU can say that will convince the American politicians that privacy and corporations are out of control in the US. Americans might believe it's fine, but Germans are careful about how personal data is handled and who has access to it.

Culturally the US and Europe is drifting further apart and from the European side it's very hard to see that the US isn't wrong.

Re: Austrian DPA Ruling Against Google Paves the Way to EU-Based Cloud Services

#76

Post by thisisnotatest1 »

zoobab wrote: post #74
thisisnotatest1 wrote: post #65

Quoted post unavailable.

"Google will just lock the data in the EU and keep doing business as usual." Personal data of EU citizens cannot be processed by american companies, full stop.

I mean do whatever you want yourself. I will keep using google, and no puerile wanker will stop me. Thanks!

Re: Austrian DPA Ruling Against Google Paves the Way to EU-Based Cloud Services

#77

Post by RHSeeger »

thisisnotatest1 wrote: post #65

Quoted post unavailable.

> Google will just lock the data in the EU

Can you explain what you mean by this? If the data is owned by Google, then the US government can compel them to turn it over; full stop. The fact that it lives in another country and never enters into the US is irrelevant; the US government can just say "give us this data, or we will do things that will cause you serious financial/legal harm".

Re: Austrian DPA Ruling Against Google Paves the Way to EU-Based Cloud Services

#78

Post by thisisnotatest1 »

mrweasel wrote: post #75
thisisnotatest1 wrote: post #65

Quoted post unavailable.

I think part of it is desperation. There is absolutely nothing the EU can say that will convince the American politicians that privacy and corporations are out of control in the US. Americans might believe it's fine, but Germans are careful about how personal data is handled and who has access to it. Culturally the US and Europe is drifting further apart and from the European side it's very hard to see that the US is…

To me, it's economic and political nationalism, and a lot of resentment.

Citizens use google and facebook and whatsapp because they trust these companies.

Politicians are trying to intervene because politicians like posturing, being the center of attention, pretending problems exist and they have the solution.

In Europe, politicians dominate too much the debate. We are gullible not for trusting google, but for trusting politcians

Re: Austrian DPA Ruling Against Google Paves the Way to EU-Based Cloud Services

#79

Post by thisisnotatest1 »

mrweasel wrote: post #75
thisisnotatest1 wrote: post #65

Quoted post unavailable.

I think part of it is desperation. There is absolutely nothing the EU can say that will convince the American politicians that privacy and corporations are out of control in the US. Americans might believe it's fine, but Germans are careful about how personal data is handled and who has access to it. Culturally the US and Europe is drifting further apart and from the European side it's very hard to see that the US is…

Pretty sure Google and Facebook have more trust than politicians.

Maybe politicians should ban themselves?

Re: Austrian DPA Ruling Against Google Paves the Way to EU-Based Cloud Services

#80

Post by zxienin »

Kbelicius wrote: post #23
zxienin wrote: post #12

The title sounds to a general impact ("..Paves the Way to EU-Based Cloud Services"). But on closer read, it seems to partially apply to SaaS/PaaS cloud services, which hold data outside EU. Google also provides IaaS/PaaS cloud offering based within EU as well [0]. [0]: https://cloud.google.com/about/locations#europe

Considering that this ruling is based on schrems II case which concluded that FISA 702 and EO 12.333 are not compatible with GDPR it would seem that holding data within the EU is not a solution since FISA 702 and EO 12.333 are applicable to data held anywhere in the world by a US company.

Am not legally savvy on this to be educated on merits of what cited FISA/EO mean.

I am curious as to what argument can find it acceptable to block US company, also when they place data within EU and can’t be compelled to handover to US law enforcement.

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