Live data from Hacker News

The rising human cost of sports betting

nytimes.com

251–260 of 337 posts

Re: The rising human cost of sports betting

#251

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> How do you square that with giving people autonomy? The Libertarian Free Market answer is that both parties need to be fully informed. Casinos would be required to post maximum win rates and otherwise fully detail their "we throw out anyone that wins" policy up-front, in a clear and easily understood format. If the casino writes a bad, exploitable policy, they go bankrupt being exploited and this encourages future…

The maximum win rates part is normally clear by the game (for example, for Roulette or Blackjack you can see odds) or otherwise regulated by local/government laws (e.g. for games of pure chance like slot machines). > and otherwise fully detail their "we throw out anyone that wins" policy up-front They can just ask the gambler to leave the premises - I cannot imagine some 'libertarian free market' solution which would…

> The maximum win rates part is normally clear by the game (for example, for Roulette or Blackjack you can see odds)

That's the AVERAGE win rate.

The maximum win rate is "if you make more than $10,000 in profit, we'll throw you out", and I've never heard of that being made explicit.

The point is that if you're going to throw out people who win more than a certain amount, you're not actually offering a fair game. There are secret rules that you haven't been told, and they very clearly bias your overall odds. You certainly shouldn't be able to advertise "you could win big!" if your policies make that impossible.

---

There's clearly precent in other industries, too: If a grocery store advertises a sale on milk, they have certain obligations to offer a rain check if they run out. "According to the Fair Business Practices Act, it is unfair or deceptive if a store advertises goods without intending to sell them or to provide reasonable amounts of the advertised products without providing notice that supplies are limited."

Casinos are advertising the chance to "win big" but have no intention of ever actually paying out.

Re: The rising human cost of sports betting

#252

I'm pretty Laissez-Faire about things, but a recent interaction with gambling is making me reconsider: My friend got a lot of free credits from the major sports books and wrote some code that he felt could generate a profit. We all threw in a little bit of money and let the program do what it does. Within a month we started doing 1k a day in profit on 3k wagered. Right as we approached 30k in profit, every major book…

Oh! You might like the Web3 ecosystem!

In the Web3 ecosystem (in this context that means Ethereum and Ethereum Virtual Machine compatible, popularized by a library called web3.js), people fork the current state of the blockchain to localhost, this allows you to test your transaction with many iterations to see if it can push the chain/contract to a subsequent valid state, if successful your code switches back to the main network (mainnet) and deploys the transaction

This is perfect for bets because you get to know in advance if the inefficiency you discovered will go through. Many contracts to interact with are black boxes that could have code to limit amounts, so you get to see a few split seconds in advance and can rapidly rule out that opportunity towards another one.

Brownie is a good library for this.

Re: The rising human cost of sports betting

#253

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> How do you square that with giving people autonomy? The Libertarian Free Market answer is that both parties need to be fully informed. Casinos would be required to post maximum win rates and otherwise fully detail their "we throw out anyone that wins" policy up-front, in a clear and easily understood format. If the casino writes a bad, exploitable policy, they go bankrupt being exploited and this encourages future…

The maximum win rates part is normally clear by the game (for example, for Roulette or Blackjack you can see odds) or otherwise regulated by local/government laws (e.g. for games of pure chance like slot machines). > and otherwise fully detail their "we throw out anyone that wins" policy up-front They can just ask the gambler to leave the premises - I cannot imagine some 'libertarian free market' solution which would…

The house edge of Blackjack, depending on the rules used, is negative with skillful play (counting cards). Casinos kick out card counters. The rate at which you can win before the casino kicks you out is not public.

Re: The rising human cost of sports betting

#256

I travel a lot on Europe (at least pre covid) and one of the worst social trends has been the spread of betting agencies, especially the aptly named Ladbrokes but a number of others too. They shoele up mostly in the poorer parts of big cities and suck the money out of poor people hoping for a break. I saw them largely first in England, then Ireland, Netherlands, Germany, Belgium and noe pretty much everywhere. They e…

Honestly, the gambling in Europe is so much sadder than the gambling in the US.

I recognize it's a marketing thing, but European companies don't seem to even try to make it look like anything but degeneracy.

Re: The rising human cost of sports betting

#257

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People like to say this because it's a nice sound-bite that lets people feel like they themselves are not among the stupid. It ignores the reality that poverty is a causative agent for lacking the appropriate math skill to recognize that playing the lottery is not a good financial choice, and self-perpetuates that poverty.

Most people buy lotto tickets so they can spend a few minutes in blissful daydream before they come crashing back down to their financial reality. It's like a very cheap drug. It makes them feel good, so it serves a purpose. Feeling good is good.

To "have a flutter" is a pretty common phrase in Australia, and maybe the UK. A quick thrill and then it fades.

Re: The rising human cost of sports betting

#258

I travel a lot on Europe (at least pre covid) and one of the worst social trends has been the spread of betting agencies, especially the aptly named Ladbrokes but a number of others too. They shoele up mostly in the poorer parts of big cities and suck the money out of poor people hoping for a break. I saw them largely first in England, then Ireland, Netherlands, Germany, Belgium and noe pretty much everywhere. They e…

I moved from the UK quite a number of years ago, and whenever I return to my home town, there are steadily more shops like this -- often multiple agencies on the same street. More affluent areas get coffee shops and estate agents. Less affluent: betting shops, and lots of them.

Re: The rising human cost of sports betting

#259

Here in Australia we have some very aggressive sporting companies, which very much to try to play it into the culture of our sports. Watching our biggest sporting event last year the AFL Grand Final, during each ad break there was a live update of the betting odds. In addition, to the sponsorship of the betting companies around the stadium.

It's sadly quite normalised here. Melbourne Cup. Betting odds broadcast alongside sport. Retired athletes spruiking. Pokies as an adjacent issue.

I know a 40ish yo mother who won't watch an AFL game without a bet on. I'm guessing she does it to make the games more interesting. Rarely seems to bet on the game result, but on quicker/earlier exotics like first goal.

Always felt like fantasy sports comps were a positive way to build on games. I've had fantasy comps with friends or randoms where they've created great conversations and community. However, it seems like those are increasingly trending to draw money and payouts rather than glory or a voucher from a sponsor.

Re: The rising human cost of sports betting

#260

I'm pretty Laissez-Faire about things, but a recent interaction with gambling is making me reconsider: My friend got a lot of free credits from the major sports books and wrote some code that he felt could generate a profit. We all threw in a little bit of money and let the program do what it does. Within a month we started doing 1k a day in profit on 3k wagered. Right as we approached 30k in profit, every major book…

Oh! You might like the Web3 ecosystem! In the Web3 ecosystem (in this context that means Ethereum and Ethereum Virtual Machine compatible, popularized by a library called web3.js), people fork the current state of the blockchain to localhost, this allows you to test your transaction with many iterations to see if it can push the chain/contract to a subsequent valid state, if successful your code switches back to the…

I can't tell if this is sarcasm or not, but I'll call you when my bookie puts his contract on the the blockchain.
Post reply on HN