Please make a dumb car • Hacker News Board

Re: Please make a dumb car

#251

Post by throwaway946513 » Mon, Jan 31, 2022, 5:49 PM UTC

noduerme wrote: post #84

Strongly agree with this article. The car I love is my 1980 Datsun, but it just isn't good in the rain. My daily car is a Fiat 124 Spider. Reason I bought it was it was the least complicated, most direct driver-to-pavement, latest, fastest ride I could get for $20k with a stick shift. I won't buy an automatic. To Fiat's credit, I think they're the last manufacturer selling cars in America whose standard price is for…

While not under $20k, the Subaru Impreza and Crosstrek are currently offered with a stick shift on the base trim, and for the Impreza Sport ($23k) it's offered standard with a stick, and an auto optional.

This may change soon to only be the WRX and BRZ with a stick shift next year, but currently their lineup is rather competitive for AWD compact cars.

Re: Please make a dumb car

#252

Post by rabuse » Mon, Jan 31, 2022, 5:50 PM UTC

porknubbins wrote: post #23

Power seats are not a pointless luxury. I’m pretty sure they are continuously adjustable which is much better than trying to pull on some lever and get the seat to pop into approximately the right place. To say nothing of mulitple drivers with memorized positions etc.

Until the motor fails, or the tracks became "crusted", and you have no ability to adjust it anymore.

Re: Please make a dumb car

#253

Post by hoppla » Mon, Jan 31, 2022, 5:50 PM UTC

I see this problem in other things too. I wanted to buy a radio, but the only option I have is an boxed in android phone running apps and a DAB receiver.

I only need two functions, a knob to change channels and one to adjust volume. If I need to play music, some aux input would be nice - that’s it!

Re: Please make a dumb car

#254

Post by thatfrenchguy » Mon, Jan 31, 2022, 5:51 PM UTC

I think the author is just becoming old? Like who mounts their phone on the car anymore on a new car?

My 2020 Kona Electric has a pretty intuitive and responsive touchscreen, buttons for climate control, and CarPlay is nice to use? All the smart driving features like emergency braking and lane centering have saved my butt multiple times as well.

Re: Please make a dumb car

#255

Post by symlinkk » Mon, Jan 31, 2022, 5:52 PM UTC

stillsut wrote: post #179

I went car shopping this year in the new market and found that that if you want more a "dumb" car (UX occurs primarily outside of a touchscreen, no internet, no geolocation) you lose all potential for any nice non-smart features. So no heated/powered seats, no power windows, the material of the interior is refurbished from a spirit airlines airplane, etc. I think manufacturers are hoping that certain aspects of the m…

It’s not some grand conspiracy lol, it’s just that they bundle features together to save on costs. Henry Ford did this a century ago by only offering the color black.

Re: Please make a dumb car

#256

Post by Johnny555 » Mon, Jan 31, 2022, 5:52 PM UTC

I don't mind having a smart car, in fact, I like most of the "smart" features - lane centering, adaptive cruise, emergency braking, TPMS, lane change cameras, auto headlights, auto wipers, etc.

But I want buttons and knobs for everything I use while driving.

I probably wouldn't pay extra for built-in navigation (it generally comes with other options that I do want), but I've found it useful a few times when I was outside of cellular coverage.

Re: Please make a dumb car

#257

Post by reidjs » Mon, Jan 31, 2022, 5:52 PM UTC

seanmcdirmid wrote: post #246

Aren't dumb cars going to completely go away once the transition from ICE to EV is finished? I could see them being like antiques or something, but they wouldn't really be economically viable to produce anymore. And of course, the fact that dumb cars would be more expensive to produce is just a side effect of digital being cheaper than analogue after a certain about of development.

Maybe, but that will take many decades

Re: Please make a dumb car

#258

Post by com2kid » Mon, Jan 31, 2022, 5:53 PM UTC

lkozma wrote: post #47

ab_testing wrote: post #10

I think a lot of the smart car features have to do with legislation. All new cars require a back up camera due to legislation. But a backup camera with a huge 8" screen is only useful for backing up. So the manufacturers try to use that screen real estate for infotainment when the car is moving forward.

Who is pushing/lobbying for that type of legislation? Isn't it a case of regulation helping the incumbents?

There are multiple long standing "Project 0" efforts in the US that aim to get pedestrian fatalities down to 0.

They have a range of goals including reducing Urban speed limits to 20-25mph and adding more safety features to cars.

Sad fact is modern giant SUVs have very poor rear visibility and children are just not visible if they are behind the vehicle. Backup cameras are the only reasonable option aside from "stop driving obscenely oversized vehicles."

(Another solution would be changing current laws so that 3 row station wagons were legal again, right now SUVs and Minivans fill a need that the 3 row station wagon used to, but it was legislated away long ago.)

Re: Please make a dumb car

#259

Post by rabuse » Mon, Jan 31, 2022, 5:53 PM UTC

EdwardDiego wrote: post #24

I would kill for Ye Olde Manually Wound windows. Electric windows struggle in temperature extremes, and seem to break down far more often than my old hand-cranked windows ever did. Also, I had more precise control with the hand-crank.

Me and my family members have had multiple window motors fail, due to leaves falling in between the window and the gasket, on completely different car manufacturers.

Re: Please make a dumb car

#260

Post by awhitby » Mon, Jan 31, 2022, 5:54 PM UTC

Eji1700 wrote: post #95

function_seven wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your second video horrified me. What the hell are they thinking with the touch-sensitive inputs on the steering wheel? Nevermind the weird shape and the issues with orientation when signaling during a steering maneuver. Those aren't actual buttons, they're no better than a touch screen. When I drive, my hands aren't always in the exact same position on the wheel. Muscle-memory won't reliably have my thumb landing on…

Glad i'm not the only one who thinks this is insane. I could maybe see a yolk, but dear god get me AWAY from touch screen style buttons in any serious process, let alone ones that can wind up in different orientations. And why in the hell does a yolk need to have the horn on a button rather than the center of the yolk as anyone would expect? Maybe there's some technical reason i'm unaware of, but this seems actively…

The horn thing doesn't seem like that big a deal actually. I've never used the horn in a potential accident situation because there's always something better I could be focusing on to avoid the accident. As pilot say: aviate, navigate, then communicate. [0] Some studies seems to support that [1].

The only accidents I can imagine the horn preventing are ones where you are stationary, which almost always means the other car is moving slowly - like somebody backing into you in a parking lot. Overall pretty low consequence incidents.

So to the extent that horn use is nearly all elective rather than emergency, is antisocial and has few benefits: make it a small, hard-to-reach button.

(With important exceptions like heavy vehicles that can't maneuver well and non-Western driving cultures that rely on routine horn use to communicate intentions.)

[0] Granted aircraft have an extra dimension to play in for collision-avoidance. [1] https://slate.com/technology/2008/11/honk-if-you-know-why-yo...