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The case against masks at school

theatlantic.com

411–420 of 1001 posts

Re: The case against masks at school

#411
As ever, another pro Covid article makes it to the front page.

As ever, HN falls over itself to demonstrate ignorance and selfishness.

Meanwhile Covid continues killing and maiming. The butcher's bill for this our collective failure is going to be hard reading.

Shame on us all.

Re: The case against masks at school

#412
post #377

General observation from reading the comments - the folks on HN must not have many friends working in medicine for if they had they'd realize those friends are swamped and burned-out. They'd also know that pretty much the only condition we're treating nowadays is Covid. Surgeries are continuing to be postponed - including surgeries that can lead to worse problems down the road such as removing cancerous tumors. And i…

People stopped having kids once they could(easily available birth control). Trying to connect it to COVID or Climate change is not supported by any data whatsoever.

Yes, having plunged dramatically in the 60s with the widespread adoption of the pill, birth rate in the US has been falling in a fairly steady rate since about 1970

https://www.macrotrends.net/countries/USA/united-states/birt...

Re: The case against masks at school

#413

General observation from reading the comments - the folks on HN must not have many friends working in medicine for if they had they'd realize those friends are swamped and burned-out. They'd also know that pretty much the only condition we're treating nowadays is Covid. Surgeries are continuing to be postponed - including surgeries that can lead to worse problems down the road such as removing cancerous tumors. And i…

> They'd also know that pretty much the only condition we're treating nowadays is Covid.

This statement might be true for your location but is not true in general. Here in New York City hospitalizations due to covid are not very high and going down quickly. Elective surgeries and procedures go on as scheduled. ICUs are not overrun with covid specific cases. Majority of the patients with positive PCR test are hospitalized for medical reasons other than covid. Recorded deaths do not differentiate between "died from covid" and "died while covid positive" making death statistics hard to interpret. In general, compared to the situation on the ground in March-April 2020 this time the covid load on NYC hospital system is lighter.

The biggest challenge is staffing shortages in the hospitals due to general burn-out, people being on sick leave due to spreading omicron. Noticeable percentage of nurses were laid off because of the vaccine mandate (i am not judging the mandate, just stating the consequence).

SOURCE: several physician relatives and friends working in NYC hospitals (Manhattan, Bronx, Brooklyn).

Re: The case against masks at school

#414
post #376

General observation from reading the comments - the folks on HN must not have many friends working in medicine for if they had they'd realize those friends are swamped and burned-out. They'd also know that pretty much the only condition we're treating nowadays is Covid. Surgeries are continuing to be postponed - including surgeries that can lead to worse problems down the road such as removing cancerous tumors. And i…

> They'd also know that pretty much the only condition we're treating nowadays is Covid. That claim is misinformation, please edit and delete. Medicine as a field is very broad and plenty of other conditions are being treated.

At your dentist or plastic surgery clinic, sure. Hospitals everywhere are short on nurses and anything that can be delayed still is. A friend was recently transfered to another hospital to give birth because the maternity ward was unstaffed.

Re: The case against masks at school

#415

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> And Omicron has made it so the risk profile is effectively the same as when this pandemic started; you will get it, you will be contagious for a time, and you will infect others. Total nonsense. Anyone's chance of dying is massively diminished with the vaccine.

Dying isn't the only bad thing that can happen to you if you contract SARS-CoV-19, and it's not just about you.

Many respiratory viruses have “long” symptoms. Covid is not even close to unique in that regard. Should we shut down everything and force little kids to wear masks for 8 hours a day for the annual flu?

Re: The case against masks at school

#416

The case against masks is quite trivial and generalizable across most industries. Today, a teacher now has two realistic options: a) self-isolate indefinitely, either teaching remotely or quitting their job b) contract coronavirus at some point Given that, masks are an irrelevance. A teacher who is clinically vulnerable and unwilling to roll the dice is left only with the option to quit their job, regardless of wheth…

We are all getting coronavirus

Re: The case against masks at school

#417
post #406

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, and? The hospital case load is overwhelmingly, screamingly, massively dominated by the elderly unvaccinated. https://www.doh.wa.gov/Portals/1/Documents/1600/coronavirus/... Given the extremely contagious nature of Omicron, what plausible way do we have to prevent these individuals from getting COVID and using hospital space? And don't say masking up kids—because if they haven't gotten vaccinated, then why do you…

I know multiple households where the initial infection vector was the kids. Grandpa might be stupid and refuse the vaccine, but keeping little Billy from becoming a carrier lessens the hospital load. If screaming Karens are going to insist on in person learning, we need to mask test and vaccinate in the schools.

Or…grandpa can get vaccinated.

I'd be more than happy to test and vaccinate in schools. In particular vaccinate. But having kids wear masks…which they don't do well, because they're kids…not like adults do it well either…is a fig leaf. It's not going to work. And you can see that from the massive infection rates in schools that have masks.

Re: The case against masks at school

#418
post #322

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sounds like you are on a path to awakening so I don't want to discourage you, but it might be worth sharing additional data and context to parts of your comment. >With vaccine intake high in most developed countries a covid infection is like a cold or a bad flu for some. That may be more driven by the mildness of Omicron than it is by the protective effect of the vaccine. For example, the latest data show that vaccin…

You're taking 14 vs 10 from table 15 on page 50 on the report. Page 51 says: > The rates in Table 15 should not be used as a measures of vaccine effectiveness due to unaccounted for biases and risk factors. The age-standardized morality rates you mentioned are for just the week of Jan 8-14 (though the same pattern is visible for earlier weeks). But, you didn't mention 3-dose stats with show the opposite pattern: - Un…

To put it more directly, the same document states (on page 36):

In the last week from 08 January 2022 to 14 January 2022, in an age-standardised population, the COVID-19 related death rate in individuals that received a booster or third dose of a COVID-19 vaccine was between 3.2 to 9.4 times lower than individuals who are unvaccinated or have only received one or two doses of a COVID-19 vaccine

Re: The case against masks at school

#419

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Americans debating every day whether strongly authoritarian and invasive measures are OK, if they save lives. In Europe seatbelts are mandatory, and it is forbidden to smoke in most places. I think that these are reasonable measures. I think, for the exact same reasons, that mask mandates are reasonable. In public transport is mandatory to wear at least a t-shirt, as skin to skin contact gets unhealthy fast. And re…

The US is not as different as you think. Seat belts are mandatory in 49/50 states, restrictions on smoking are common, restaurant employees generally need to wash their hands after going to the bathroom, "no shirt no shoes no service" is the general rule, nudity in public places is generally against the law. I don't know where you are getting your impression of US laws from, but it's just wrong.

> restaurant employees generally need to wash their hands after going to the bathroom

I struggle to grasp a society where that has to be mandated

Re: The case against masks at school

#420

Wtf, masks absolutely work. Who is pushing this stuff and for what nefarious reasons? Do they think all children should get exposed early to the virus and then we'll develop heard immunity in decades to come? We have the vaccine for that.

If we have a vaccines, why do we need masks? Do vaccines not work or something?
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