The case against masks at school • Hacker News Board

Re: The case against masks at school

#231

Post by twic » Thu, Jan 27, 2022, 7:21 PM UTC

rhino369 wrote: post #113

tsycho wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From their website (About/Disclaimer): _The Unmask is not designed or intended to prevent, mitigate, treat, diagnose or cure any disease or health condition, including COVID-19/Coronavirus. Unmasks are intended for general public use only. They are non-sterile and are not intended for use in any clinical or surgical setting or where exposure to bodily or hazardous fluids may be expected, where the risk of exposure th…

Read between the lines. They are marketing for people who don't want to wear a mask but have to. These "masks" are designed to do the bare minimum to get you onto an airplane. It's not supposed to protect you.

People buying this mask disappoint me. They should at least go full hose:

https://fakemaskworldwide.com/the-offensively-fake-fake-mask...

Re: The case against masks at school

#232

Post by huetius » Thu, Jan 27, 2022, 7:22 PM UTC

criddell wrote: post #15

My kids attend a university in Canada and live in residence on campus. They have had incredibly strict rules around masking and gatherings. It's clear that they are only considering one variable - number of infections - and it seems like they aren't considering any other factors. For example, in the dorm there is a common area with a piano. Because of COVID, playing that piano is banned. Even if there was a reasonabl…

This one-dimensional approach is especially bad since the emergence of omicron, where number of infections doesn’t even capture the level of COVID danger.

Re: The case against masks at school

#233

Post by TameAntelope » Thu, Jan 27, 2022, 7:23 PM UTC

sfotm wrote: post #226

TameAntelope wrote: post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The amount of time you spent trying to keep others safe is washed down the drain when you give up for no reason other than you’re tired.

This isn't really true, regardless of whether you like masks or not. There have been one or two level changes with respect to how much risk you're introducing to those around you as well as the personal accountability of those you'd affect. It's not surprising that different people have different tolerances for these risks. Even without the above factored in, this is sort of like saying that not using your turn signa…

It's not about individual risk, it's about collective risk, and honestly it's quite selfish to consider the COVID risks only with regard to yourself.

And Omicron has made it so the risk profile is effectively the same as when this pandemic started; you will get it, you will be contagious for a time, and you will infect others.

By looking at that risk and accepting it, you're throwing away the work you've previously put in to avoid being a bad person.

Re: The case against masks at school

#234

Post by PaulDavisThe1st » Thu, Jan 27, 2022, 7:23 PM UTC

hydrok9 wrote: post #221

PaulDavisThe1st wrote: post #206

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I tried to explicitly state that I believe that your mental experiences are real and worthy of attention and care. > I should say, it makes a huge difference to my mental state, even if the change in oxygen is relatively small. This is the key point. The change in airflow and oxygen is extremely small. None of that means your mental state does not change when wearing a mask, but it is probably useful to understand th…

The key point is that you are wrong. It is absolutely due to a physiological process. You are telling me that it is "all in my head," and that it is impossible that a cloth mask over my face restricts my airflow. I am telling you it isn't. >I tried to explicitly state that I believe that your mental experiences are real and worthy of attention and care. I appreciate that. But you should be aware that people with anxi…

Please see my larger edit in my original comment at https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30104420

I was wrong.

Re: The case against masks at school

#235

Post by jasonshaev » Thu, Jan 27, 2022, 7:23 PM UTC

throwaway22032 wrote: post #118

criddell wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have a feeling that if the same people were tasked with setting road speed limits, they would set it to 20 mph and argue that 30,000 lives will be saved each year. They aren't wrong, but it's misjudging the risk most of us are willing to accept for the benefits of being able to move around quickly.

Ah, that one's actually happening. There are actual attempts to ban cars in my neighbourhood now because some people judge that the marginal effects of air pollution outweigh the enormous benefit of me being able to visit my friends and family in literally a quarter of the time. These people don't think about benefit. It's only cost. I've come to think of them as simply being depressed, in the chemical imbalance sens…

And here you are making pseudoscientific judgements (chemical imbalance?!) about a huge number of people you've lumped into a group and referred to as "these people."

I'm seriously surprised you haven't been downvoted off this thread.

Re: The case against masks at school

#236

Post by mosdave » Thu, Jan 27, 2022, 7:24 PM UTC

skrbjc wrote: post #125

zdragnar wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've been exposed to covid-positive people multiple times in my home (each time they found out they were positive after), no masking involved. I get tested after each exposure and have yet to get it either. Wearing masks and not catching covid is like wearing a bandana and not getting into a bike accident. It is an extremely contagious aerosolized virus that cloth masks simply aren't sufficient to stop. Meanwhile, th…

Funnily enough, I've seen many people riding bikes in the street with no helmet, but wearing a cloth mask.

https://stanfordreview.org/stanford-bicycles-helmets-masks/

Re: The case against masks at school

#237

Post by veemjeem » Thu, Jan 27, 2022, 7:24 PM UTC

xondono wrote: post #219

hogrider wrote: post #122

Wtf, masks absolutely work. Who is pushing this stuff and for what nefarious reasons? Do they think all children should get exposed early to the virus and then we'll develop heard immunity in decades to come? We have the vaccine for that.

> Wtf, masks absolutely work. I’m not that sure. A lot of experts agree that there’s not much quality data to reach that conclusion. Most “definitive proof” comes from mechanical studies (they measure how far your saliva is reaching with and with out mask), but that’s not the only important factor. Masks are not designed for full day use, and by wearing them everyone is constantly touching their face, mouth and nose.…

Nurses working in the ICU during the beginning of the pandemic would use the same mask for an entire week without losing efficacy. If the masks didn't work, we would have seen a huge number of them infected in the NYC hospitals but that didn't happen. Most viruses don't survive very long on surfaces.

Re: The case against masks at school

#238

Post by jasonlotito » Thu, Jan 27, 2022, 7:24 PM UTC

spookthesunset wrote: post #111

throwaway22032 wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is the fundamental issue with coronavirus mitigation measures. There are circumstances in which "drop everything" makes sense - if coronavirus were ten times more fatal, we'd do it naturally. But in general, looking at life from a perspective of "what is the minimum possible quality of life we can have" is depressing and fundamentally incompatible with the human spirit. I tend to think that people who operate in…

For two years we’ve been asked to park our problems and to act like literally all that matters is the spread of Covid. Nothing else matters. Just a myopic fixation on the spread of one highly infectious respiratory virus. Even a year after vaccines we are still being asked to treat Covid like it is the #1 priority in our lives. More important than our well being, our mental health, our communities, our children, or a…

> For two years we’ve been asked to park our problems and to act like literally all that matters is the spread of Covid.

The problem is only half the population really followed through. These measures are still needed more because half the population effectively thinks COVID is no big deal or a hoax.

Re: The case against masks at school

#239

Post by TameAntelope » Thu, Jan 27, 2022, 7:25 PM UTC

brimble wrote: post #230

TameAntelope wrote: post #209

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right, but you aren't really someone who should have much of a say over this, and neither are any parents. The people most knowledgable about this topic are (though not universally) arriving at the conclusion that children should continue to wear masks. Besides, wearing a mask is not exactly a heavy burden to bear. Yes, it's annoying, but the consequences of not doing so are also annoying, and in more than zero cases…

> Besides, wearing a mask is not exactly a heavy burden to bear. Yes, it's annoying, but the consequences of not doing so are also annoying, and in more than zero cases deadly. Sure, but tons of things are deadly in a non-zero number of cases, which most people give no thought to. Micromorts are everywhere. I've been baffled at the strong anti-mask reaction and the way so many people've wanted to toss mask mandates a…

There aren't tons of things you do that actively harm others, and when there are those things, they're regulated and compliance is enforced via legislation.

Wearing/not wearing a mask is not a heavy burden to bear, and by not doing it, you're increasing the net risk of everyone around you, in addition to your own.

That's what makes this different from wearing a helmet 24/7. But you knew that! Why is this the thing we can't do for one another, this small, one thing?!

Re: The case against masks at school

#240

Post by dymk » Thu, Jan 27, 2022, 7:26 PM UTC

standardUser wrote: post #170

spookthesunset wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For two years we’ve been asked to park our problems and to act like literally all that matters is the spread of Covid. Nothing else matters. Just a myopic fixation on the spread of one highly infectious respiratory virus. Even a year after vaccines we are still being asked to treat Covid like it is the #1 priority in our lives. More important than our well being, our mental health, our communities, our children, or a…

I have to assume you live on the West Coast. I have spent a couple months in and around SF during pandemic, but I live in NYC and have travelled to many other places. The West Coast experience seems to be a singularly restrictive experience. I'd hesitate to assume the entire nation is experiencing things the same way as you describe them (they are not). Though it does seem like many students across the nation are get…

It also depends where on the West Coast you live, of course. It's more of a city/rural divide.

I live south of Seattle. Seattle is restrictive, everybody outside is wearing masks, many restaurants are still take-out only, business are open for limited hours.

But you go 40 minutes south to, say, Puyallup, and the COVID restrictions are much more relaxed (if present at all).